/lgbt/ - LGBT » Thread #5113774

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Anonymous Thu 22 Oct 2015 15:21:13 No.5113774 View Reply Report Delete

Quoted By: >>5113778 >>5113850 >>5113855 >>5114536 >>5115116 >>5116285

Straight, white male here.

I'm writing a book with female lead who is a lesbian. I'm wondering what themes or ideas I should have in my book to add to the realism. Anyone have any suggestions, perhaps from reading other books with gay leads that come off and fake.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 22 Oct 2015 15:22:26 No.5113778 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>5113810

>>5113774
Play Life is Strange for inspiration

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 22 Oct 2015 15:30:53 No.5113810 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>5113778
ooh that is helpful

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 22 Oct 2015 15:46:59 No.5113850 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>5113774
fuck u

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 22 Oct 2015 15:48:57 No.5113855 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>5113862

>>5113774
Physical assaulting and raping women, and screaming out about being oppressed.
It's generally the only things lesbians do.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 22 Oct 2015 15:51:00 No.5113862 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>5113855
was wondering when someone would post this response.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 22 Oct 2015 16:11:00 No.5113933 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>5114503

OP here. Didn't realize how many retards were on this board.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 22 Oct 2015 18:18:33 No.5114503 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>5113933
Yeah, it's pretty bad sometimes

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 22 Oct 2015 18:24:40 No.5114536 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>5114919

>>5113774
>I'm wondering what themes or ideas I should have in my book to add to the realism

Ceaseless emotional and physical domestic violence.

Getting dicked. A lot. (which they promptly forget about and never mention again).

Pointless college degrees, particularly studio arts and political science.

Repulsive sweaters.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 22 Oct 2015 19:50:22 No.5114919 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>5114536
>Repulsive sweaters.

is that a thing?

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 22 Oct 2015 20:11:35 No.5115032 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>5115116

For a start don't kill them(or their lover) at the end. The tragic lesbian shit is so way over-done to the point where when a lesbian or bisexual woman appears in a show I like I'm immediately fearful.

Also don't construct a ridiculous scenario where the lesbian for some reason has to have sex with a dude. It happens more often than you think(Hannibal).

Also, find a balance between being "in your face" about the fact that she's a lesbian and making it totally inconsequential. A lot of "totally not homophobic but" people complain about the in your face thing and basically want their LGBTQ characters to have their queerness as invisible as possible... you need to strike a balance where it's still an important part of them, but isn't all of them... which can be hard to get right, though there's no one point. Some characters will be very into their sexuality, for others it'll be more of a footnote. For a protag you're best off going for a middle ground.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 22 Oct 2015 20:26:07 No.5115116 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>5115136 >>5115169

>>5113774
what's the time and setting, op? what's it about, vaguely? what do you want the character to be like? it's best if you tell us what you want the character to be like so that we know what to tell you not to do.

I agree with >>5115032 except I don't know what they're talking about with the first point.

Don't make them a loud-mouthed dyke. Also, don't make it a woe-is-me, it's-so-hard-to-be-gay piece, it's all been done a million times over. It's easier to do if you're actually gay, but how I write gay characters is by not mentioning they're gay. Make it obvious enough and don't do any verbal gymnastics to avoid saying things that sound too gay. Also, please don't write a sex scene. We don't need another one and it only ostracizes your readers.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Thu 22 Oct 2015 20:30:07 No.5115136 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>5115153

>>5115116
>make sure to completely strip your gay characters of anything that makes them seem gay in any way

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 22 Oct 2015 20:32:08 No.5115153 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>5115136
>reading comprehension
not what i said anon, but okay.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 22 Oct 2015 20:35:42 No.5115169 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>5115116
there's ways to write or imply a sex scene without being explicit about it. I've seen it done a lot in books, it's pretty common but I hardly see it done with gays. It's either explicit porn or just ignored like homos are sexless mormons.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 23 Oct 2015 01:30:50 No.5116285 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>5116335

>>5113774
I'm not the kind of person who says straight men shouldn't write lesbian characters. But if you're relying on an anonymous Malaysian shoe-stitching image board to inform the character, maybe don't write a lesbian lead character.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 23 Oct 2015 01:58:38 No.5116335 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>5116285
op's long gone by now once he didn't get what he wanted within the first few posts. don't bother, he won't read this. he's gonna fuck up the book, anyway.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 23 Oct 2015 02:08:18 No.5116351 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>5116433

Avoid the most hated tropes: lesbian dies or sacrifices herself. Also, rape. For some reason a lot of lesbian characters are either raped, have babies from rape, or are subject for attempted rape.

I like lesbian characters that I can relate to - ones that aren't whiny, and ones that are content with their sexuality. If you were to go to the thread on /u/, the regular posters there are well versed in lesbian characters.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 23 Oct 2015 02:51:01 No.5116418 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>5117397

What is even motivating you to write a lesbian lead? Why?

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 23 Oct 2015 02:56:06 No.5116426 Report Delete

Quoted By:

lesbo here. She should be wearing flannel with cut off sleeves.

More background on the story is needed. Consider giving her 3+ small sized dogs.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 23 Oct 2015 02:59:49 No.5116433 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>5116480

>>5116351
What about an asshole evil male of indeterminate race who she cares for deeply but constantly uses her and talks her into all kinds of mischief and even talks her into bed.
What if she loves fucking him and him in general but is deeply in love with a woman and loves women.

Would that seem off. To have a section start with him showing up on her doorstep one day after going out on a date with her ex-girlfriend then in the next chapter a deeply detalied sex scene where he's fucking her brains out and she's desperately trying to rationalize her feelings.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 23 Oct 2015 03:17:56 No.5116479 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>5116489 >>5116496

I'm not the OP but I'm actually here, straight male, and willing to talk about what Im writing.

It's a fantasy/adventure romance story set in the midst of a cold war on a futuristic planet. The leads are all female (3 with 2 supporting) and are mostly les or bi.

The only problem I seem to have is that the lead is "a dude but female" in some spots. She finds things I find heterosexually attractive about women such as cute nuances in speech, delicate shoulders/collars, and generally acts "alpha" in situations (she's less emotional and more decisive in moments such as pulling a flustered lover by the hips interrupting mid sentence with a kiss).

Am I overthinking it? I'm obviously going to analyze my fault against a heteronormative lens and then fall into a misguided attempt to step away from that but end up just being sexist.

Like if I say "well she shouldn't be so decisive she should be ruled by her emotions" I just went from bad writing to sexist writing...fuck. How do I fix her? She has a lot of family growth and social aspects that make her feminie already so I don't need to "build up" a base for her gender/orientation

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 23 Oct 2015 03:17:57 No.5116480 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>5116501

>>5116433
You're confusing realism with your sad fantasies, anon. Irl lesbians have male orbiters, and those male orbiters are optimum cringe.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 23 Oct 2015 03:22:15 No.5116489 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>5116512

>>5116479
Women can be masculine too, lesbians tend to be masculine more often than straight women do. I wouldn't worry about it.

All your leads being gay is odd though, unless that has something to do with your plot or they purposely met through some kind of support network. That would raise some flags for me.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 23 Oct 2015 03:22:48 No.5116492 Report Delete

Quoted By:

As a gay woman, in my opinion you should make it as real as possible. Not some strapped up bull that acts like a guy.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 23 Oct 2015 03:24:10 No.5116496 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>5116533

>>5116479
Lesbians are pretty much straight men in a woman's body. If you're worried she's coming off as too masculine that's not really the problem. You just have to sell her as a solid character. Try to describe her inner emotions, explain where she's conflicted and how she's reading things as they're happening, don't try to focus too much on her actions but the emotions and inner reasoning behind her actions. Even then, you won't have many people claiming she's "too manly" acting. They might even enjoy a female character who doesn't fit the classic support role.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 23 Oct 2015 03:25:45 No.5116501 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>5116551

>>5116480
Yeah, but all women have those. Men do to. Lesbians like to play those losers up as all men want to fuck me cause "me eat em some poon tang". And that's anything but true.
They don't shoo them away or discourage them. Why? Cause they want men around and like having the "back up plan" male.

And, yeah most lesbians do have that one guy they can't so no to.

No, I'm talking about for this story and the impact it would have on the audience. Espescially lesbian audience. We all know the TRUE LEZ GOLD STAR 100% losers would leap out of the woodwork to angrily fling shit. That's just how it goes.
I want to know the unfiltered opinion of lesbians not just the wrote and trite kneejerk over the top defense of their own sexuality that is a direct and hypocritical mirror of men who'll flip their shit if anyone even hints that they're anything but straight.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 23 Oct 2015 03:29:24 No.5116512 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>5116521

>>5116489

>all your leads being gay is odd

The fact that they're 1)mostly les and 2)all female isn't a political statement. Nor is it an exploitation or a selling point of the product.

I don't read femslash and I'm coming at it from a genuine interest in female leads and lesbian romance in a mainstream product. I'm excited as hell that the lead in the new Star Wars film is female. Is it naive to think that the characters just being who they are won't work? The story seems fine with then and it's about 65% finished.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 23 Oct 2015 03:32:46 No.5116521 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>5116550

>>5116512
Dude, the only reason the leads are LGBTQA females is because YOU want it.
They don't exist outside of your wishes.
You want to sell a story about lesbian romance during the cold war. That's your hook, that's what you're selling.
Have the fucking balls to own up to it and stop insulting everyone's intelligence, including your own.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 23 Oct 2015 03:39:47 No.5116533 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>5116496

Roger that. I think you're right because overthinking the character just seems forced and she's already a complex and fully developed driving force.

Could I get some thoughts on sex-positive sexy romantic sex scenes? I know how to do romance and I have a healthy view on sex and relationships that will come across as sweet, genuine, and generally "human".

Im not against idealizing the sex, because it's a damn fantasy saga (graphic novel). But I -do not- want to put in something that makes real lesbians cringe because "we don't really do that".

Again, Im a very sex positive person who has a lot of sex so I think about most depictions of lesbian sex and go "yeah I can see that" -but then shit like scissoring comes up and I think "there's no way that feels good"

What unrealistic shit should I avoid, while still allowing an "ideal" sex scene between two women?

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 23 Oct 2015 03:45:18 No.5116550 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>5116565

>>5116521

Slow down there anon. I want to sell a fantasy epic where the characters are lesbians.

Yes, I've never read anything like that. Imagine a Final Fantasy where all the chacters are lesbian but the story stays the same and their orientation and gender is practically a non issue...you'd still sell it on the fact that it's a fantasy rpg with an epic story. Not lesbians.

I'll own up to wanting to see and write what I want but it's a celebration to me of the female sex via unremarked integration and domination of the product. Not "Star Wars with lesbians!!"

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 23 Oct 2015 03:45:53 No.5116551 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>5116501
Please be a troll.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 23 Oct 2015 03:52:27 No.5116565 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>5116594 >>5116616

>>5116550
But their orientation and gender is an issue. You're quite clearly trying to sell a story about lesbians in a fantasy land.
That's your hook.
Just fucking own up to it.
Don't act like it's some kind of supreme act of destiny or that this particular thing just fell into your lap. You chose it for a reason.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 23 Oct 2015 04:07:01 No.5116594 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>5116616

>>5116565

>that's your hook

I'll never agree with you anon. I just can't see it that way. Call me naive but the fact that it is a matter of discussion at all is a sad comment about the world we live in.

I chose then because these are the characters I dreamt up and fell in love with. This was the story I wanted to see and tell.

It has NEVER been a book in the vein of "well let's see how this sells by rattling the industry with this unorthodox set of characters". The women as being women and their orientation is NOT a selling point or an issue outside of the book itself, and is only mildly of any note within its pages.

This is for people that love adventure and whirlwind romance. Suspence, action, and, humor. Fantasy and mystical sci-fi. And Im much too passionate about it to ever remotely consider the possibility of selling it on anything else, SPECIALLY NOT some current socio-political reason as if I had anything to say on the matter. I'm not an activist and Im not a panderer. I'm just writing a book with characters anon -for the reason of escape and entertainment

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 23 Oct 2015 04:22:57 No.5116616 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>5116565
>>5116594

I should add that I understand that being lgbt is a "banner" for you. It's a flag that you've had to wave. It's a -difference- if you will that you've "dealt" with in current society. And I won't presume to know what issues or lack there of youve have nor what normal or non-normal way this has affected.

Im coming at this from a post-modern perspective. From a place where nobody needs labels. From a place where everyone just "is".

I know that's difficult to understand but I just don't want to irritate you or any anon here with this. Imagine a dimension where everyone just was regardless of race orientation and religion. That's the place Im writing this from. Maybe it won't be appreciated as such for a long time. But the sooner we start healing from all this bullshit we've wrapped ourselves up in and just start perceiving people by their character the better.

And I guess in that way I want to make a "statement" by not making one at all. As if this was 100 years in the future...

I hope that makes some semblance of sense. I need sleep.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Fri 23 Oct 2015 11:44:44 No.5117359 Report Delete

Quoted By:

OP here. For starters, I am not "relying" on the opinions I find here. Most of my friends are in the LGBT community, including many female friends.

As far as plot goes, I'm not really sure where I want it to go, but my main character is named Alex and she's white. She's from Hawaii and struggles with her identity in a lot ways, more than just the lesbian aspect. Being from Hawaii and being white is complicated issue for her. She lives in Washington now, though, but her family is back in Hawaii.
She's quite sporty because she has a really close relationship with her dad.

Last, and yes I understand this is going to sound douchey, but I think I can make it work: It won't be entirely clear when reading the book if she is female or not. Her name is Alex and she has a girlfriend, so readers couldn't instantly think Alex is male. But that is not so.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 23 Oct 2015 11:58:44 No.5117397 Report Delete

Quoted By:

OP here. Yeah, please don't confuse me with the fantasy writing dude. We have very different ideas here.

>>5116418
Lots of friends who are lesbians, In a lot of ways, I don't really understand straight guys...I definitely identify with women a lot more than men. That's a really broad statement in answer to a question I could write paragraphs about. Hope what I said will suffice.

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