/tg/ - Traditional Games » Thread #43294723

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Pathfinder General /pfg/

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 07:17:40 No.43294723 View Reply Report Delete

Pathfinder General: The Stick is Wedged Firmly in Iomedae's Posterior Edition
Extract it at your leisure

Unified /pfg/ pastebin
http://pastebin.com/NYB3QyVp

Previous thread: >>43280042

Anonymous

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Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 07:21:44 No.43294755 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43294766 >>43294831 >>43294866 >>43295517

How would you run horror in Pathfinder?
What would you use?
What level?

Anonymous

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Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 07:22:49 No.43294763 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43295044

>>43294723

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 07:23:00 No.43294766 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43294774

>>43294755
rust/curse elementals that can permanently damage/curse the magical items of the party.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 07:24:17 No.43294774 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43294766
That's not true horror, that's just the GM's excuse for being a dick.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 07:31:48 No.43294827 Report Delete

Quoted By:

Hey, is anyone familiar with RPG BOT?
I'm really liking his guides and his style, but i wish he'd do more prestige classes. There's no such thing as a "update page", so i'm left behind.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 07:32:46 No.43294831 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43294866 >>43299270 >>43299581 >>43303907

>>43294723
Remember that you can have LE clerics of Iomedae and Paladins of Asmodeus.

>>43294755
I used a city that was partially absorbed into the Plane of Shadow. Most of the creatures had the Shadow Creature template applied to them. I also used the "creepy effects" tables from Heroes of Horror.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 07:38:15 No.43294866 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43296298

>>43294755
>>43294831
Also, it was levels 4-5. Pic related. A depiction of the wood elf rogue in the group.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 07:39:30 No.43294876 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43294936 >>43295001

Do you point it out when a player is getting a strong benefit from a misreading of the rules, and you think the GM just hasn't noticed rather than intentionally letting it slide?

I think it's the right thing to do, but makes me feel bad whenever I do it and it leads to the player losing the benefit.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 07:41:13 No.43294892 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43294924 >>43295066

http://theworldissquare.com/feat-taxes-in-pathfinder/
Thoughts on this?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 07:46:02 No.43294924 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43294892
I found that article early on in my PF GMing and almost entirely agree with it.

Though I don't give power attack for free - because personally I've made a number of builds that don't use it or its ranged/dex equivalents, so I see taking power attack as a non-mandatory choice.

Merging all the TWF feats into one is really strong too, and something I need to think more on next time a player wants to take it.

I also have this passage at the bottom of my homerules:
"Qualifying for feats: Even though a number of prerequisites have been removed or given for free, to figure out whether you qualify for a feat you need to be of the minimum possible level to take it as if there were no homerules.
Eg You don't need Spell Focus (Conjuration) to take Augment Summoning, but if you have no bonus feats from race/class then you can't take Augment Summoning until level 3, because that's the earliest level a non-feat-discounted character could access it.
You can keep track of this separately for each feat, you don't need to calculate as if you'd already taken other hypothetical prerequisites for any different feats you have."

Anonymous

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Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 07:47:52 No.43294936 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300077

>>43294876
Yes, but I'm usually the DM, so I let the player remake their character.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 07:57:51 No.43295001 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43295217

>>43294876
first of all you should privately inform the player of his mistakes.
if he doesn't want to crrect the situation then just play. there is no reason to ruin the game and the friendship, unless it's really fucking broken.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 08:04:54 No.43295044 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43294763
oh god

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 08:08:03 No.43295066 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43294892
dexterity is one of the best, if not the best stat in the game.

it increase AC, REFLEX saves, Initiative bonus, many of the best skills for martial classes, and ranged to-hit.
just compare it with what strenght does.
keying meele to hit or meele damage to it it's definitely worth a feat investment.
it's just weird that you need 2 feats to add both damage and to-hit to it but at the same time one is too little.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 08:11:40 No.43295092 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43295182 >>43295394

So /pfg/, is there any way to become immune to the dazzled condition?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 08:25:43 No.43295182 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43295092
>Dazzled
>-1 to attack and perception

wowit'sfuckingnothing

Shrug it off. You can be dazzled all day and barely notice it.

Or just shell out 4000gp for a cracked Pale Green Prism ioun and 200gp for a cracked Incandescent Blue Sphere ioun to boost your attack and perception by 1 each, so being dazzled brings you back to 'normal' and you get bonuses whenever you're not dazzled.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 08:33:10 No.43295217 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43296257

>>43295001
But then if I only inform the player and they correct it quietly themselves, it rules out the possibility of the GM saying 'oh I misunderstood, but I like my version better so let's homerule it to working that way' which isn't exactly rare and not a bad thing.

It's also partly because I want to use the thing myself, with either possible version of the ruling, but I'd feel bad knowingly capitalizing on what might be the GM's ignorance, but I also don't really want to silently hold myself back when the above reply could happen

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 08:57:42 No.43295363 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43295374 >>43295429 >>43295876 >>43296009 >>43296470

I stumbled around a sword that grants enhancement bonus to STR.
Since it isn't a belt - how do you treat it's permanency?
Suppose I clench to it for 24 hours, but what if put in under my bed when sleeping in an inn?
To think about it - how do you treat items with enhancement bonuses in general? Suppose I need to bathe and take my belt of physical rapist off. Will it be required to wear this belt for 24 hours again to make the bonuses permanent?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 08:58:47 No.43295374 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43295363
>its

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 09:02:47 No.43295394 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43295092
Wear sunglasses?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 09:03:53 No.43295401 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43295427 >>43295433 >>43295436

Hey all. I had a rules question. Is it possible to remove reliance on magical items for characters by giving them static bonuses at level up instead? Always hated having players decked out like christmas trees and all that and was wondering if it was possible to give them inherent bonuses like 4e had and if so what would they be granted to and how often would they recieve them?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 09:07:12 No.43295427 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43295401
Literally
Read
The SRD
There's a page for exactly that

Anonymous

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Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 09:07:51 No.43295429 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43295555

>>43295363

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 09:08:27 No.43295433 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43295499

>>43295401
They released something like that in Pathfinder Unchained. I don't particularly like the way it was implemented though.

http://www.d20pfsrd.com/gamemastering/other-rules/automatic-bonus-progression

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 09:08:59 No.43295436 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43295499

>>43295401
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/gamemastering/other-rules/automatic-bonus-progression

Use as a base and tweak to your liking.
If you reduce the players' wealth by level accordingly then be aware it will make them a bit weaker on the whole as it removes the option to specialise their budget allocation according to their class.
Some people may also have class features that grant bonuses that don't stack with these automatic ones, so consider changing the bonus types to allow for that if needed.
(Though some things definitely aren't meant to stack, like the +2 INT meant to emulate getting a headband of INT, and the spell Fox's Cunning, etc)

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 09:21:15 No.43295499 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43295527

>>43295433
>>43295436
was going to be running an eberron game soon and was hoping to use this. any suggestions. from looking at the list i might just count the characters 2 levels higher as the thing suggests

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 09:24:07 No.43295517 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43294755
>How would you run horror in Pathfinder?
Badly. Pathfinder is not well-suited for horror games at all.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 09:26:48 No.43295527 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43295499
My recommendation would be to pool the "body" and "mind" enhancements and let your players assign them as they will. Most classes don't want their ability score bonuses spread out that evenly, especially not while you're still leveling up. That was my biggest issue with the Automatic Bonus Progression.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 09:30:30 No.43295555 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43295429
So if you'll get an enhanced pair of pants you are supposed to poop in them?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 09:31:42 No.43295564 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43295587 >>43295590

I want to wedge my stick in Iomedae's posterior!

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 09:33:40 No.43295587 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43295790

>>43295564
I want to restore the glory of Taldor.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 09:33:51 No.43295590 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43295778 >>43295794

>>43295564
>Honor
>Justice
>Rulership
>Valor
>...
>Female
WHY?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 09:35:05 No.43295595 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43295677 >>43295982

Sorry for 3.5 question in PFgen, but I'm looking to join a 3.5 game and the current party has the following members (according to the players descriptions):

-'Magic focused Duskblade'
-'I wanna be a physical fighter' (he hasn't decided yet, but seems like probably Fighter/Barb/Pal)
-Druid (no details)
-Cleric (no details)

Starting Lv.6, campaign planning to run until Lv.10 or so.

I'm thinking Wizard, but that's a bit too obvious, wondering if anyone has any ideas on other good synergies.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 09:44:17 No.43295653 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43297368

Archives of Nethys is down.
Is there an alternative? Not srd, since there are a lot of stuff missing.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 09:46:56 No.43295677 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43295595
Well sorry to tell you but Pathfinder stopped to be thinly veiled 3.5 a long time ago, we can't help you.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 10:01:30 No.43295776 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43295802 >>43295835

Why is Path of war so poorly written? I mean, the idea is fantastic, and I do like myself some tome of battle. But the Stalker class alone makes it such that you should never, ever not at least take a dip in it for that awesome advangate-disadvantage stuff. Some schools are broken as fuck when compared to others (I'm looking at you Trashing Dragon, Veiled Moon and Broken Blade).

Anonymous

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Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 10:01:42 No.43295778 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43295866 >>43298242

>>43295590

Didn't you get the memo? All of the important deities are female.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 10:03:21 No.43295786 Report Delete

Quoted By:

does anyone have the up from darkness pdf guys?

Anonymous

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Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 10:03:40 No.43295790 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300683

>>43295587

>tfw you will never restore the glory of Taldor because it goes against JJ's fetish.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 10:04:39 No.43295794 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43295812 >>43295866

>>43295590
She's basically Holy Mary + Jeanne d'Arc

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 10:05:35 No.43295802 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43295835

>>43295776
It is quite literally one man's homebrew put to book form. Libram of Battle. There was no "team" to point this stuff out, and there was no fanfare for its playtest, IF it had one.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 10:07:36 No.43295812 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43295794
you did forget to mention Slut and really bad Musican

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 10:09:15 No.43295821 Report Delete

Quoted By:

Have you ever read, watched or otherwise consumed media where hero(es) have capabilities above T4 and enough Int to appropriately utilize them? I think 3.x skewed my perspective on what to consider "heroic fantasy".

Elric !iXwZjp.UKU

Elric !iXwZjp.UKU Mon 26 Oct 2015 10:11:48 No.43295835 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43295878

>>43295776
DSP was much smaller, and it was pretty much ErrantX working by himself on PoW. Everything was fan insight, there was no real editor or anything like that.

>>43295802
It did have a playtest, about three threads worth on GitP. The playtest for PoW was how Gareth and I got on the writing team for PoW:E.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 10:16:26 No.43295866 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43295778
It just struck me right now.
Also a lot of prominent figures, like that lich princess, that slut with red monstrous hands, Yaga.
>>43295794
I'm okay with strong woman, really, have nothing against iconic barb.
But daym... chauvinist was derived from chivalry.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 10:18:02 No.43295876 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43295363

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 10:18:20 No.43295878 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43296005 >>43296023

>>43295835
Yeah, it shows. Like read the level 9 maneuver from Veiled moon. It's something along the line of . "He who DARES to step in the path of a master of the Veiled moon will be punished." Then some fluff, then crap and then it goes something like "He will be thrown to another dimension for his insult"

Seriously, this is something I would have written when I was 12. There's like one ability in a school that with a ridiculously high save dazes you for 1d4+1 rounds. Daze in pathfinder is pretty much instant death and there is a very small list of stuff that is not immune to it.

And that advantage-disadvantage thing? "Cool, let's make a class that can force you to reroll every d20 you make and take the lesser amount. It lasts the number of rounds equal to my wisdom modifier by the way. Oh, and wisdom is my main stat. Why, fuck you, that's why."

And one prestige class...some shadow thing that does almost all force damage to everything, has stealth like +40 on level 10, can turn ethereal as a stance, be blurred all the time. And the tip of the frosting? It uses it's wisdom for everything. Instead of Con, instead of strength, instead of fucking everything. So, basically you can have more hp than a barbarian without even trying just by amping your own stat and hitting far, far stronger than he ever could.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 10:32:07 No.43295982 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43295595
So you have 2 of the best, easiest to manipulate classes in the game, one of the worst, and low tier 3?
Go half minotaur crusader and make sure everyone knows that they will not be getting past you ever.

Elric !iXwZjp.UKU

Elric !iXwZjp.UKU Mon 26 Oct 2015 10:35:55 No.43296005 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43296155

>>43295878
PoW has been pretty controversial from the get go, just like its predecessor Tome of Battle. We plan on going back and rebalancing things once the current book is out the door, but at this time it simply isn't feasible to do.

I will say that I think you're hyperbolizing a bit. Umbral Blade is only +20 stealth at level 10 (character level 16 minimum), and only adds IM to damage and HP, and locks you into its stance, which you can only use for a limited time until 10th level (again, minimum character level 16).

As for the rerolls thing, Stalker certainly enjoys some powerful arts, but its far from game breaking. The stalker in my Kingmaker game makes liberal use of Combat Precognition but he's far from invulnerable.

We'll take your feedback under consideration for when errata time rolls around. Thank you.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 10:36:13 No.43296009 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43296107 >>43296138

>>43295363
Look, man, how do shit like cloaks, belts, etc work?
Guess what? No DM is so anal as to declare you need to be holding a sword for 24 hours to get it's effects, because at some point, clothes need to come off. It's a system conceit, so stop worrying about unless the DM presses you on it.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 10:38:42 No.43296023 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43296133

>>43295878
Hey, anon?
If you are going to bitch at the devs about something, stop sperging out about it, it tends to have you taken seriously. Half the shit you said is either overblown or just wrong, or the equivalent (or renamed) of a spell effect.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 10:47:53 No.43296107 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43296142

>>43296009
You are right.
I'm just worrying because my DM is rather forgiving and always plays with us, not against us, so granting some leeway to the party just to better shape our characters is a common thing.
That's why I'm such a pendantis when it comes to rules - I want to be strict, so it wouldn't seem like I'm abusing it.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 10:50:30 No.43296133 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43296155

>>43296023
>says half of the shit he said is wrong
>never points out what and how exactly
>"stop sperging about it"

Anonymous

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Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 10:50:45 No.43296138 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43296009
>because at some point, clothes need to come off.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 10:50:56 No.43296142 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43296182 >>43296196

>>43296107
I have never in 20 some years of playing D&D seen a DM who got on about the whole 24 hours thing (which didn't really exist previously, save for a few items like Ring of Sustenance) unless they planned on stealing the item from you soon.
It's more your DM doesn't see the fun in endless minutae and bean counting, so doesn't bother with it.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 10:52:01 No.43296155 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43296133
>never points out what and how exactly
>because the dev himself already called him out on his sperging here >>43296005, why do I need to?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 10:55:04 No.43296182 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43296199

>>43296142
>person plays D&D for more years than you having developed consciousness

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 10:56:37 No.43296196 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43296142
Or there's a fucking kender in the party.
>Sorry anon. He 'borrowed' your ring for a few minutes so, you've got no protection from the hard vacuum you're being exposed to!

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 10:56:49 No.43296199 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43296182
You think that's funny?
My first DM has been playing D&D for 36 years.
I am 33, and the second oldest in our circle.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 11:02:45 No.43296257 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43295217
>It's also partly because I want to use the thing myself, with either possible version of the ruling, but I'd feel bad knowingly capitalizing on what might be the GM's ignorance, but I also don't really want to silently hold myself back when the above reply could happen
I usually talk about taking it and then going to the player and ask how he interprits that part. Maybe he and the DM already has talked about it and ruled it like that. If not, maybe you and him can pact and keep silent about it to the DM and casually abuse it until the DM checks up on it.

Shit. I've been in a campaign like this for 4 years now and since no one else wants to checks the craft rules since I'm usually the crafter, and when not they ask me for help. I get a lot of stuff done.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 11:03:51 No.43296267 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>Open up Chronicles
>The art in Technology Guide

Holy shit some of these weapons are pretty, and some of them look nothing like I expected.

Zero Pistol/Rifle should be switched with the Laser Pistol/Rifle.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 11:06:11 No.43296298 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43294866

Oh wow that's some bad art right there.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 11:20:50 No.43296424 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43296457 >>43296630

So what's that new poison-based alchemist archetype supposed to be called? I saw the toxicant, but that seemed a bit underwhelming, so I'm hoping that isn't it.

Also, who here is excited for the inevitable Eldritch Archer errata that says their shit doesn't work with guns, I know I am!

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 11:23:40 No.43296457 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43296500 >>43297165

>>43296424
It's banned in PFS anyway, so errata is unlikely.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 11:24:56 No.43296470 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43295363
A similar question came up in our group in regards to an enchanted bow that gave bonuses to perception.

The ruling was that of abstraction. As long as that item remained 'on' you, you received the benefits.
It was 'on' you unless it was specifically said not to be.
Bathing in a stream and it's stashed on a rock, or asleep and it's under the bed or beside the bedroll, it was still 'on' you.

Got stripped by the guards before they shoved you and a burlap sack into a cage, it wasn't on you anymore.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 11:28:11 No.43296500 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43296457
Maybe so, but paizo also hates guns, and they hate it even more when martials get nice things. Eldritch Archer is a nice gunslinger dip and vice-versa, and right now it's the only way I can see to make guns fun to use again. Hopefully you're right and paizo leaves this unmolested, but the cynic in me says otherwise.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 11:42:20 No.43296626 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43296666

>High King Olaf Haginsborg unites the Linnorm Kingdoms under his banner, declares it to be a realm that will last 10,000 years
>Year later, a strangely localized earthquake loosens a keystone from an arch and slips out of place, crushing High King Olaf's skull.

I bet the druids are behind this.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 11:42:31 No.43296630 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43296658 >>43296684

>>43296424
>Unused missiles, rays, or effects remaining at the end of the eldritch archer's turn are wasted.
I assume holding the charge doesn't apply to Eldritch Archer either, making it worse than regular Magus?

Anonymous

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Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 11:45:42 No.43296656 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43296670

What are some other ways to viably punch my enemies into submission
I know synthesist summoner and unarmed swordsage. I vaguely remember mystic being a class that punch viably right using stuff like the elemental fist right?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 11:45:54 No.43296658 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43296630
Probably, but it's a better way of using guns, which is the important part because guns are cool. Remember, spellstrike and spell combat are explicitly able to work with cantrips, so a simple acid splash cantrip will net you a small bit of bonus damage, and more importantly a free second attack whenever you want.

Arcane Bond also lets you grab a weapon for free, but unlike the gunslinger it can be a revolver AND start out masterwork.

The question for me though, is if you need it in your hand to cast spells or if it can just be on your person.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 11:46:42 No.43296666 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43296931 >>43297128 >>43299629

>>43296626

Holy shit.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 11:47:06 No.43296670 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43296689

>>43296656
Aurora Soul mystic? Maybe.

Related options: Meditant psychic warrior and Deadly Fist soulknife, particularly with Gifted Blade.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 11:49:37 No.43296684 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43296630
Not really, not having to go melee is kind of a huge advantage. Having ranged spell combat alone means that if you want, you can stay back and buff while full attacking. It's a pretty huge advantage, honestly.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 11:50:16 No.43296689 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43296670
>Aurora Soul mystic
Yah that's what I was thinking of, I checked path of war earlier and didn't see it but now that I googled it I see it's path of war expanded. Haven't heard of meditant physchic warrior or the deadly fist though, I'll have to check it out

Anonymous

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Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 11:52:40 No.43296711 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43296725 >>43296727 >>43296749 >>43296865

Hey guys this looks pretty cool but I don't really know anything about this and the pastebin is kinda confusing truth be told so I'm curious if anybody would be willing to help a beginner out with some pdfs or just an quick explanation if possible

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 11:54:57 No.43296725 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43296753

>>43296711
It's literally just D&D 3.5, dude.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 11:55:02 No.43296727 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43296749 >>43296783

>>43296711
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/

literally everything you need to know.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 11:57:41 No.43296749 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43296783

>>43296711

The first question we need to ask is if you've played 3.5e.

If so, I've found the easiest way to understand a difference in systems is creating a character, and when I come across something new or unexplained I look it up.

The d20pfsrd as linked here >>43296727 is perfect for looking things up, and a good character creator that walks you through the process is thus: http://www.pathguy.com/PathfinderCore.htm

Obviously there are more classes and races out now, but it's always nice to start at the foundation before building the tower, no?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 11:57:52 No.43296753 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43296771

>>43296725
No not really. It turned away from just being thinly veiled 3.5 a long time ago.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 11:58:44 No.43296762 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43296851 >>43297300

Could I get some general tips for scroll creation and use?

We're on a low level / resource campaign so scrolls are a big way of extending the collective usefulness of myself (an Arcanist) and my fellow caster (a Bard). She has the scribe scroll feat.

I think we can do things like have her scribe a spell I know and that's on her list (e.g. invisibility) to create a scroll we can both use. Any other tips? How does having multiple spells on one scroll work and is there a cost increase? Are there any (cheap) magic items that facilitate scroll creation? All tips welcome!

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 11:59:24 No.43296771 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43296753
Okay, 'literally' isn't quite what I meant, but the apparent veil of confusion surrounding the post I responded to kind of deserved a "If you know 3.5 you know this." sort of post.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 12:00:43 No.43296783 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43296727
>>43296749
Thanks a lot guys!

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 12:06:24 No.43296829 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43296855

what kind of action is it to pull out/ tuck away a weapon?

say for example that i want to put away my bow and pull out my lute to play a song, will the action of me pulling out the lute consume my action?

where do i see at what levels/ times i earn feats?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 12:08:28 No.43296851 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43296762
>All tips welcome!
Don't take scribe scroll on spontaneous caster?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 12:08:39 No.43296855 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43296935

>>43296829
>what kind of action is it to pull out/ tuck away a weapon?

Free action to drop a weapon (for most DMs this is considered putting it away.)

Move action to draw a weapon, unless it's a dagger in which case it's a swift. If you have Quick Draw, this turns into a free action to draw a weapon.

If you have more than +1 BAB, you can draw a weapon as a free action during a move action.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 12:09:12 No.43296865 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43296711
There are a huge number of guides running around as well (I wrote four of them), just give us a general theme for the character and someone here will be able to point you in the right direction

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 12:17:05 No.43296931 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43297162

>>43296666
You know, it's lines like that which show to me that Paizo still has a little bit of humor to them that actually works.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 12:17:10 No.43296935 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43296855
thanks, buddy

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 12:32:31 No.43297086 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43297111

Hey, do you guys think it's proper tabletop etiquette to not look at other player's character sheets unless they explicitly say you can?

In the group I'm in, we all upload our character sheets online for the DM to collect, but they're out there in the open and it's never been said that we shouldn't look at each other's sheets. Whenever I want to check on something about another character, like whether someone else in the party already has X skill covered or what spells the spontaneous caster knows, I'll look over the other players' sheets. It's never been a problem before, except this time when I looked at our new druid PC's sheet I saw some references to his backstory and learned about some secret stuff the other players don't know about.

I haven't mentioned it at all and it's not like it's a huge secret with significant implications (it's just that the druid's current race wasn't his original race, thanks to a Reincarnate spell) but it still makes me wonder if I'm maybe committing some faux pas every time I look at someone else's sheet. I'm not going out of my way to hide it, it's just that the subject has never come up and I've never really thought about the fact before that maybe it's not something I should do.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 12:34:49 No.43297111 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43297086
If they posted it publicly, its fine.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 12:37:00 No.43297128 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43296666

I can't help but imagine Jorri's face when he ran into their fetish.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 12:39:44 No.43297162 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43296931

You should read their companions and chronicle works, they're actually very solid most of the time (and the few times they aren't, well, you'll see familiar faces as the authors.)

Land of the Linnorm Kings supplement is some top-shelf stuff, as are quite a few of the other supplements.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 12:40:10 No.43297165 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43297584

>>43296457
It got banned that quickly, huh? What, was it the idea of a Magus' DPS at range that made them reflexively reach for a ban? Is the shitty ranged Magus archetype still legal?

Anonymous

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Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 12:40:30 No.43297168 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43297355 >>43297360 >>43297387

We talking about punching stuff, I like punching stuff

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 12:51:15 No.43297300 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299187

>>43296762
She can create a scroll of a spell even if it's not on her list, so long as SOMEONE supplies the spell. Scribe Scroll is generally a pretty poor choice for a spontaneous caster since they get few spells known but lots of spells per day, but there's nothing stopping her from making scrolls of any spells you can cast for her. Hell, if you guys had a cleric in the party, the bard could even make scrolls of divine spells with said cleric's help.

As far as multiple spells on a single scrolls goes, I'm not actually sure there is any advantage to it, except that by virtue of it being one scroll it only takes one action to pull it out. So in other words, if you had three separate scrolls, you would have to take an action to pull each one out and another action to use them individually, whereas if it was one scroll of three spells it would only take a single move action to pull out (but still three actions to use all the spells on it). A minor benefit, I guess.

There are a few feats like Cypher Magic to help with scrolls, but that's not a very good feat and I doubt your bard qualifies for it anyway. However, there's a magic item that could be very useful, and it's called Mnemonic Vestments. They could be very useful for your bard, if she's carrying a lot of scrolls of spells that aren't on her list of spells known (which she can craft, thanks to you supplying them).

Anonymous

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Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 12:55:31 No.43297355 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43297168
I like punching stuff too.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 12:56:34 No.43297360 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43297432

>>43297168
This is Pathfinder, no one punches stuff without being shitty compared to people that don't punch stuff. I guess we can still talk about it, though.

If a Hungry Ghost Monk wanted to go about trying to become a Lich, how do you think they'd do it? Where could they find a spellcaster powerful enough and lacking in scruples enough to craft a phylactery for them? Could a Lichdom ritual be made using the new Occult Ritual rules?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 12:57:17 No.43297368 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43297398 >>43297466

>>43295653
Yeah, d20pfsrd is pretty goddamn shite not gonna lie

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 12:59:16 No.43297386 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43297402 >>43297409 >>43297411 >>43297845

Lookingat Occult classes and have some questions with Kineticist...

Do they have limits on abilities per day? I can't seem to find any.

http://www.d20pfsrd.com/occult-adventures/occult-classes/kineticist

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 12:59:18 No.43297387 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43297453 >>43297607

>>43297168
Speaking of punching stuff, how would I improve an unarmed Brawler's to hit bonus without spending a lot on an AoMF or a bunch of feats? This is the Brawler class, not the Fighter archetype.

1pp only preferably

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 13:00:01 No.43297398 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43297466

>>43297368
They still don't have fucking gortheks.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 13:00:20 No.43297402 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43297386
Burn is their limit per day.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 13:00:47 No.43297409 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43297386

A L L D A Y
L
L
D
A
Y

They don't, but the burn cost is a fairly hard limit to me being /useful/ in a day.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 13:00:50 No.43297411 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43297386
No, they just kill themselves to use most of their abilities in a half-competent manner.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 13:02:28 No.43297432 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43297726

>>43297360
>implying they wouldn't want to become a Graveknight instead

Instead of accursed armor, they have accursed robes and mantle.

http://www.d20pfsrd.com/bestiary/monster-listings/templates/graveknight-cr-2

Also, you forget - ANYONE can take Craft Wondrous Item now. That means anyone can make a phylactery.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 13:03:39 No.43297447 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43298094

How would you build one punch man in pf? Everything allowed

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 13:04:22 No.43297453 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43297387
Brawlers can use magic weapons. Such as a pair of cestus, which are ideal brawler weapons. You can also have Greater Magic Fang cast on them and permanency spell used, but if it gets hit with a targeted dispel, it will go down.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 13:05:01 No.43297466 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43297398
>>43297368

Why not use pfsrd for general interests and Archive of Nethys for specific interests?

They're both useful, personally I find the web design of pfsrd pleasant.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 13:06:48 No.43297479 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43297541 >>43298112 >>43299260

Can you guys help me name my campaign? It's been going on for several sessions but I don't really have a name yet.
My party is looking for a cure for a sort of blight that is spreading through a big mountain chain called "The Red Mountains". The name comes from the many many battles that has been held in the region and because of its natural color.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 13:10:34 No.43297541 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43297554

>>43297479

Baldur's Gate

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 13:11:28 No.43297554 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43297578 >>43299215

>>43297541
I have not played the game.. Am I ripping off its story?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 13:13:21 No.43297578 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43297592 >>43299215

>>43297554

It's about a blight infecting all of the ore supplies causing weapons and armor to be super brittle.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 13:13:36 No.43297584 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43297165
If you mean Myrmidarch, yeah it is, but it doesn't get ranged spell combat.

It was a preemptive ban BTW, banned it before the book hit the shelves basically.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 13:14:09 No.43297592 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43297578
Goddamnit

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 13:14:50 No.43297607 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43297698

>>43297387
Exemplar archetype. It's kinda really cool.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 13:23:22 No.43297698 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43297607
It actually does look good looking at it now. I ignored it initially because of the teamwork feats, but I don't need anything it replaces and Inspire Courage is a pretty decent attack boost for free. Thanks anon!

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 13:25:08 No.43297726 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43297432
Are you talking about Master Craftsman, or is there something else new that I don't know about?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 13:28:55 No.43297777 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43297894

How good are Vitalists at low levels (sub 6th)?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 13:34:37 No.43297845 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43297386
Many of their abilities are "at-will", but in order to get any use out of them you have to use a daily resource in the form of burn. Keep in mind one point of burn gives you your character level in nonlethal damage that can't be bypassed in any way.

If you want to play a kineticist, ask your GM if you can omit the nonlethal damage part. If your GM is a retard and thinks the kineticist is overpowered, just play a sorcerer and throw lots of metamagic fireballs.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 13:38:18 No.43297894 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43297777
They get their best healing ability right at level 1.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 13:45:21 No.43297962 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43298025 >>43298071 >>43298137

So I'm bout to build my wizard and I was thinking of what race I want to be, I was thinking something exoctic for variety. Right now we have a drow, high elf, dwarf and a human in the party. Off the top of my head I was gonna pick a Kobold and speak with what little german I know. What would be some other good races for a wizard?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 13:50:19 No.43298025 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43298071

>>43297962
>What would be some other good races for a wizard?
+Int or floating bonus, no Con penalty.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 13:54:27 No.43298071 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43297962
Anything with a bonus to INT is automatically at least a decent choice for Wizard. Some other race features like Darkvision, Keen Sense, or anything that helps with spell casting (like elves getting +2 on penetrating SR) is good too, but it's the INT bonus that's important. DEX and CON are, obviously, your next most important stats, so having a bump to them or at least avoiding a penalty is nice too.

>>43298025
A penalty to CON suck for anyone, but a wizard can deal with it. At low levels the extra hit point or three won't save you if you've done fucked up, and at higher levels you can afford to boost it up to a more respectable level with a belt. Obviously it's better to avoid a CON penalty if you can, but I just mean it's not a deal breaker if you're intentionally trying to mix things up and play something other than generic opti-wizard #337.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 13:56:06 No.43298094 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43297447
You can't, by rote.
Even in his own setting, OPM is recognized to break all the laws that govern his universe.
You can't make him in anything that actually works by RULES, because he exists to break them. He is walking DM fiat.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 13:57:34 No.43298112 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43297479
Call it Chi Bi.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 13:59:38 No.43298137 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43298209 >>43298308

I'm going to make a gunslinging eldritch archer before the inevitable errata. My main concern is getting some static damage from an ability score on my iterative attacks. Is there any way besides a 5-level gunslinger dip to get some ability bonuses on my damage rolls with firearms?

>>43297962
Tieflings offer a Dex and Int increase out of the box, and only take a penalty to your dump stat. On top of that they're plenty exotic, and have some neat racial features that might come in handy. Favored class bonus is pretty mediocre for wizards though.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 14:04:02 No.43298209 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43298137
>Favored class bonus is pretty mediocre for wizards though.

That's okay, it's perfectly fine for a wizard to take an extra hit point as his favored class bonus every level.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 14:06:40 No.43298242 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43295778
Its so that you might have a chance at fucking them m'lord.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 14:08:23 No.43298264 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43298311 >>43298313 >>43298354 >>43298582

Daily reminder that the kinetistist is a fine class, /pfg/ just can't build classes for shit.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 14:11:08 No.43298308 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43298470

>>43298137
3 levels of Trench Fighter gets you the DEX to damage feature.

I can't think of anything else off hand.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 14:11:27 No.43298311 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43298359

>>43298264
Daily reminder to ignore obvious bait.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 14:11:43 No.43298313 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43298359 >>43298532

>>43298264
Kinetisrist is perfectly valid for what it is meant to portray, which is fucking Scanners and Firestarter, and not Avatar the Last Airbender.

/tg/ cannot into context.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 14:13:58 No.43298344 Report Delete

Quoted By:

Any of the Occultist archetypes any good?
Tome Eater and Battle Lord look like cool concepts for building a character around.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 14:14:41 No.43298354 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43298264

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 14:14:59 No.43298359 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43298404 >>43298415 >>43298470 >>43298797

>>43298311
denial is the first stage of grief.

>>43298313
Basically. The three rules of building a optimized kinetistist,
>18+2 con
>don't take any more burn than elemental overflow needs
>deal damage
Are really too difficult and complicated for the super-genius god-arcanists at /pfg/ to understand.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 14:19:06 No.43298404 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43298482

>>43298359
There's no need to be passive-aggressive.

The reason that /pfg/ and others hate the Kineticist is because it is nowhere near as effective of a class as the original stated-goal was, and that it is outdone in what it is meant to do (deal damage and have a small bit of utility) by a Fighter semi-optimized to use a bow, let alone something like a Bard or Alchemist. It's weak and it doesn't need to be, because 3.5 proved that you can make a magical at-will class that doesn't rely on a stopper effect and won't be overpowered. The fact that a warlock is strictly-better out of the box, let alone with all the expansions over the years of 3.5's lifespan and the homebrew that came after it, just aggravates things more.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 14:19:54 No.43298415 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43298482 >>43298742

>>43298359
Have fun with Expert With Bow levels of damage genius, also being forced to harm yourself to do an essential function of your class that anyone with skill ranks in UMD can outshine you in is terrible design in general

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 14:24:09 No.43298470 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43298482

>>43298308
A three level dip just to use a weapon with a small degree of effectiveness is still pretty heavy, at that point I might as well take the 5 in gunslinger for the other goodies they get.

>>43298359
>All you have to do is use this class feature as little as you can get away with
>oh and have less damage than everyone else at every developmental milestone
>and less utility
>oh and you have to take unavoidable, incurable nonlethal damage
>and have fun with spell resistance, energy resistance, and immunities
>with more bookkeeping than a Mystic Theurge
>see guys making a good kineticist is easy

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 14:25:30 No.43298482 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43298532 >>43298533 >>43300818

>>43298415
So you don't know how the class works. That is fine. Just admit it earlier next time.

>>43298470
Again...just write out "I don't know how to build one, and therefore shouldn't talk about it" next time. It is fewer words.

>>43298404
I agree on that point. Optimized fighter archer levels of damage is nothing to write home about, but It is by no means "useless". I also enjoy breaching the hugbox of idiots like >>43298415

Anonymous

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Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 14:29:13 No.43298532 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43298624

>>43298313
>fucking Scanners and Firestarter,
Or I could just play a Psionics Wilder and actually be useful

>>43298482
>Fighter
>not useless
>that posting style
>"lel people disagree with my obviously superior Intellect, therefore they are uncomfortable about my totally objective truth and don't want their hugbox broken

Confirmed for virtualoptim

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 14:29:14 No.43298533 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43298624 >>43298655

>>43298482
>So you don't know how the class works. That is fine. Just admit it earlier next time.
Clearly you are the only one who does not understand how it works. You still take nonlethal damage for hitting minimum elemental overflow you chucklefuck.

Building a kineticist is easy, just grab an air kineticist and fly away every time combat happens.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 14:31:56 No.43298582 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43298264
Daily reminder that the Kineticist isn't the worst class in OA.

It's the Medium.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 14:34:30 No.43298624 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43298716

>>43298532
>Killing things isn't usefull! I could put them in a web then burn high level spells summoning shitty things to kill them instead!
Yea no. If you actually play games, you would know that kililng things is often a really effective way to deal with problems. Web and blinded and whatever make killing them easier, but you still usually like to kill things eventually.

>>43298533
>you still take nonlethal damage for hitting minimum elemental overflow you chucklefuck.
And your 18+2 con and d8 HD mean that you still have more hp after elemental overflow than everything but paladins and barbarians.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 14:36:41 No.43298655 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43298533
>Building a kineticist is easy, just grab an air kineticist and fly away every time combat happens.
Goddammit anon, you made me cough up my drink.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 14:40:58 No.43298716 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43298758

>>43298624
>but you still usually like to kill things eventually.
Which everyone, not just the Fighter, can do. "Kill things good" is something that nearly every class has options for that are superior to all but the most minmaxed and focused kineticist. Also power isn't just about combat, its the ability to apply class features to solve a multitude of problems and encounters beyond combat.

Then again you would know this if you played in actual sessions instead of just sitting in on PFS play.

Please piss off virt. Shouldn't you be off bitching about Shadowrun on your blog?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 14:42:15 No.43298742 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43298858

>>43298415
"Expert with Bows" is a meme, not reality. It's a low-tier class, but it's not that low as it actually does do somewhat decent damage.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 14:43:32 No.43298758 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43298829 >>43298839 >>43298852

>>43298716
what is a virt?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 14:44:09 No.43298770 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43298868

I've skimmed through the Alchemy manual and saw the Craft Ooze feat
Is there a viable way to play an Oozemaster? Beside the above feat I only know about the Cave Druid (turn into ooze) and that Alchemist discovery
Also where I can find other official options for Grafts?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 14:46:07 No.43298797 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43298867 >>43298885 >>43299000

>>43298359
And if you're doing anything less than a 25 pt buy how do you get yourself the 18+2 CON you NEED (per your requirements) in order to play a kineticist?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 14:48:24 No.43298829 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43298758
I'd say lurk moar, but that doesn't really work anymore.
Virtual Optim was a highly prolific troll on /tg/ that despite truly shit tier behavior that outstripped almost any tripfag in the history of this board I can remember (MAYBE Verity trumps him), he NEVER got banned, and in fact, people would get banned for reporting HIM.
Finally, hiro-moot brought the orbital tungsten banhammer on him, but since he airplane modes away, he still posts without the trip.
He is easily identified with a stilted posting method where
Every sentence

is spaced out

similarly to this

along with a very egocentric

rationale behind his posts, where disagreeing

with him means you clearly are of inferior intelligence.

So, yeah, you see him, and you will, report the fuck out of him.

Thanks.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 14:49:19 No.43298839 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43298869 >>43298893

>>43298758
Virtualoptim. A massive cancer that plagued /tg/ until Hiroshimoot officially banned him. They then came back later in his banning thread and said he would "Officially" drop his trip. He also believed that Pathfinder was balanced, and that Shadowrun, 5e, 4eee and just about every other system to exist was bad.

He was also a massive edgelord and had a supersized ego.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 14:50:12 No.43298852 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43298758
A vile breed of gremlin, mostly focused on sabotaging discussions by screaming idiotic falsehood or stating something without verifying. Also tends to react to people pointing out the flaws in its silly claims by insulting their intelligence.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 14:50:38 No.43298858 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299000

>>43298742
Someone hasn't seen Mr. Bubbles' stats. While it is somewhat exaggerated to an extent, its not really wtong

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 14:51:31 No.43298867 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43298918

>>43298797
It's simple, Anon. If you aren't playing 25 point buy, you don't play a kinteticist. They're like monks in that regard, don't play them if you don't get 25.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 14:51:38 No.43298868 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43298770
The problem with crafting oozes is that you can't actually control them in any way or transport them easily. Great if you want to build a dungeon though.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 14:51:39 No.43298869 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43298907 >>43298915 >>43298924 >>43298935 >>43299000

>>43298839
>pathfinder balanced
Well I guess i'm not him, because I think the game world doesn't even function if a single arcane caster gets 7th level spells...

Doesn't mean the kinetistist is a bad class, or at least not worse than a paladin

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 14:52:40 No.43298885 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43298918 >>43298973

>>43298797
You put 18 in con, and then put ~14 in dex, and dup what you don't need? How is this hard?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 14:53:07 No.43298893 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43298935

>>43298839
>He was also a massive edgelord and had a supersized ego.
You mean like all trippers

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO You know what this is.png, 810KiB, 1480x364

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 14:54:13 No.43298907 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43298869

>At least not worse than a paladin

You'd better be able to back that up, pal. Paladins are really, really good at what they do.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 14:54:53 No.43298915 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43298869
The paladin doesn't punch himself in the dick to cast spells or smite evil though.

Unless the DM is a dick and makes the Paladin fall for stupid reasons, but that's more the DM doing it and not a major class feature.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 14:54:58 No.43298918 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299703

>>43298867
And yet the kineticist somehow /isn't/ a shit tier class? I mean even a fighter can be serviceable at 20 pt. buy, and passable at 15 if you're willing to really work at it.

A class with that narrow of a requirement to be functional

>>43298885
18 starting costs 17 pts. So you're playing a retarded autist in order to meet the minimum requirements to make the class functional? How is that good?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 14:55:18 No.43298924 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43298869
So you're not a troll. Just wrong. Kineticist is shit, this isn't a /tg/ meme, this has been noticed in the GitP forums and even by the few sane people left on the Paizo forums.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 14:56:21 No.43298935 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43298869
A paladin CAN do the things it says it can out of the box, ie slap the shit out of evil creatures with minimal optimizing (str/con/cha).
A kinetisist, without optimizing, can't do the things it says out of the box.
>>43298893
Keep the /b/ attitude in /b/, anon.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 14:57:55 No.43298965 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43298987 >>43298991 >>43299125

Fine. Ill put my money where my mouth is. BRB building a 12th level kinetistist. Lets see how this goes.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 14:58:19 No.43298973 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43298885
>+2 Dex
>3/4 BAB
>Literally 50% hitrate against same CR enemy at point-blank range.
Please.

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO 1420345060652.png, 443KiB, 850x1051

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 14:59:53 No.43298987 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299043 >>43299067

>>43298965
Someone already built a level 12 Barbarian, right? We can see how they compare; if the Kineticist actually IS a 'decent' class, it should be able to compete in the same party as said Barbarian without being blatantly-worse at everything.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:00:06 No.43298991 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43298965
Then compare it's damage output to other primary damage dealing classes with the same amount of optimizing.
People have already done this, that is why people say it's garbage.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:00:53 No.43299000 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299045 >>43299052 >>43299077 >>43299102

>>43298797
To be fair, what the FUCK are you doing playing anything below 25 PB?

>>43298858
A warrior with a bow will consistently get better damage than a kineticist, even WITH it spending burn to get composite blasts. If the kineticist had anything else besides its crap damage this probably wouldn't be a problem though.

>>43298869
>Doesn't mean the kinetistist is a bad class, or at least not worse than a paladin
The paladin isn't a good class, but it's amazing at its one niche: making evil things dead. On top of being a competent martial, it gets great saves and 1-4 spellcasting, buffing auras, and the ability to smite the everliving fuck out of anything with an evil alignment. Besides alignment restrictions being cancer, the paladin can compare to other martials favorably in some regards.

The kineticist doesn't serve any useful niche, as everything it does is done infinitely better by pretty much everyone. Having access to at-will flight is less of a boon than one would think, as it's easy to get flight when you would actually need it. Other than that, the kineticist combines all the worst aspects of a spellcaster with the worst aspects of martials, and unlike either class type doesn't get any of the positives to make up for it.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:04:27 No.43299043 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299066 >>43299067 >>43299069

>>43298987

The Barbarian was a cheesy mounted lance build. That's not at all a typical barbarian build and hardly relevant to what a barbarian is normally capable of.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:04:34 No.43299045 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43299000
I don't play at anything less than 25 pt buy, but 15 is the "standard" and 20 is what's "expected" in published adventure paths. Most classes don't need 25 pt buy to be built to minimum competency, and classes that do are probably badly designed.

It's still a valid point.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:04:53 No.43299052 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43299000

Trips for truth

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:05:48 No.43299066 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299107

>>43299043
You don't need a mounted build to have an effective barbarian.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:05:51 No.43299067 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299167

>>43299043
>>43298987
It was a 6th level barbarian, meant to compete with the damage of a 12th level zen archer monk or something.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:05:57 No.43299069 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43299043
Except that even a regular "ME AXE THINGS" Barbarian is better than a Kinteticist. And if you fully trick-out the Kineticist, then a Barbarian should be fully tricked-out too. Stop moving goalposts.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:06:34 No.43299077 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299109 >>43299114 >>43299120

>>43299000

Umm... pretty much everyone plays at 20. 20 is the standard. If you only play at 25 then you must not play very often.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:08:51 No.43299102 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299425 >>43299439

>>43299000
>To be fair, what the FUCK are you doing playing anything below 25 PB?

If you think 25 points is standard, or even expected, the only games you play are retarded joke campaigns.

I'm sorry, you can't optimize with 15? Fucking good. Now maybe you can start making an actual character.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:09:19 No.43299107 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299128

>>43299066

Of course you don't but the point is using a cheesy mounted lance build is hardly indicative of a normal build. It's a highly specialized wank build to prove a point, not something widely playable.

All I'm saying is, if you're gonna use builds as "benchmarks" then make the build actually, you know, a valid benchmark. Your standard barbarian is not going to be mounted using a lance. He's gonna be swinging a greatsword or axe.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:09:23 No.43299109 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299126 >>43299129

>>43299077

>Low Fantasy 10
>Standard Fantasy 15
>High Fantasy 20
>Epic Fantasy 25

15 is the official 'standard'

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:09:40 No.43299114 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43299077
My DM had us start at 15.
That said, the game has been fairly low powered. We haven't been involved in much more than the affairs of a single outpost on the edge of civilization, but we have made strides on that end.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:10:42 No.43299120 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299149

>>43299077
>pretty much everyone plays at 20.
Only if they want Martials to not have enough skill points or out of combat utility

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:11:03 No.43299125 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43298965
I have PsyBomb's full attack calculator sheet. He accounts for hit and crit, plus resistance. Just post your attack bonuses, damage, and crit rate and I'll put up the DPR expectations.

Just gotta go find that bestiary spreadsheet with all of the median/mean numbers per CR to get target definition

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:11:05 No.43299126 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43299109

APs use 20, and most DMs in my experience also play with 20.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:11:07 No.43299128 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299136

>>43299107
So... make a 15pb lvl 12 barbarian?
All 1pp?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:11:13 No.43299129 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299167

>>43299109
And Paizo has gone on-record saying that the Adventure Paths should be played at 20 point-but, that 15 is too low.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:12:10 No.43299136 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43299128
>all 1pp

It wouldn't be valid otherwise.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:13:04 No.43299149 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43299120
Nah, 20 is the shit head default.

25 is the sweetspot

15 is "so you want me to roll a fullcaster" mode.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:13:45 No.43299158 Report Delete

Quoted By:

The only time a DM has considered using 25 is when the DM didn't want to bother with finding a 4th player so they considered letting us use 25 to make up for the lack of a 4th.

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO AM USABLE BARBARIAN (f) (12th Ba (...).pdf, 457KiB, 1x1

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:14:11 No.43299167 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299176 >>43299211 >>43301096

>>43299067
They never actually built it. They said they would and then didn't.

If you want a level 12 barbarian here one is:

>>43299129
Paizo has gone on record publishing sacred geometry.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:14:59 No.43299176 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43299167
I'd say that in this case, 20 PB is the standard for Paizo games and most people's home games, which is what we're balancing this against contest against.

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO ohwow.png, 23KiB, 143x190

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:16:23 No.43299187 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299261

>>43297300
>She can create a scroll of a spell even if it's not on her list, so long as SOMEONE supplies the spell.

Wait, is this true? The rules for scroll creation in the PFSRD state that "The creator must have prepared the spell to be scribed." I thought scrolls were an exception to the normal standard that any spells necessary can be supplied by others, like for misc magic items.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:18:29 No.43299211 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299320 >>43299368

>>43299167
The guy with the monk didn't post a full build either. Just a stack of attack bonuses and 1d8+18 damage per shot.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:18:43 No.43299215 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43297554
>>43297578

The whole Iron Shortage isn't that big of a point in Baldur's Gate IIRC. I'd say Baldur's Gate (especially Throne of Bhaal) is more like Highlander if anything.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:21:11 No.43299243 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299291 >>43299297

All three of the Pathfinder games I've been in have used 25 pointbuy. I'm surprised people even use 15.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:21:19 No.43299246 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299279

Would injecting intravenously or pouring a potion of healing into an unconscious/bleeding person's wounds cure them?

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO dagoth_master_by_lelek1980-d5cc0ih.jpg, 2MiB, 2025x709

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:22:42 No.43299260 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43297479
>Blight
>Red Mountain
are you memeing me

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:22:46 No.43299261 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43299187
Scrolls are spell completion items, so you need the spell prepared or have someone with the spell prepared, or whatever. Point is you need the spell available to make the spell.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:23:32 No.43299270 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299581

>>43294831
What book is your pic from? I always thought she was LG.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:23:56 No.43299279 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43299246
Intravenous maybe, but you need Oils to heal someone by pouring it on them. Potions can be dumped down an unconscious person's throat though.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:24:35 No.43299291 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43299243
>All three of the Pathfinder games I've been in have used 25 pointbuy.

Good for you? That doesn't actually mean anything.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:25:02 No.43299297 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300157

>>43299243
15 works for fun games where the GM wants to smack the players with a challenge.

20 PB is easy street.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:26:33 No.43299316 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299337 >>43299622

Hey guys, I know we're discussing point buy, but my group used a method of rolling, please tell me the pros and cons of this.

Everyone gets a free floating 18 to put in any score. Then you do the 4d6 drop low for five stats and assigntthem however you please, then you get your racial modifiers

It's been a decent system so far, plus my lucky rolling and use of Middle-age allowed me to have a Barb with decent mental scores. But I'd like your opinions

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:26:54 No.43299320 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299343 >>43299353

>>43299211

don't know what guy you're talking about but I'll make a monk build if you want

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:29:00 No.43299337 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299377

>>43299316
This actually seems decent since nobody gets hard fucked by not having a decent number in their important stat, and the rest are 4d6 drop the lowest which is the only decent way to do things.

Fuck people who do 3d6 where they lie, seriously.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:29:30 No.43299343 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299378

>>43299320

This is the monk people are talking about.
>>43271919'

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:30:13 No.43299353 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43299320
Nah, I can make my own monks. Iirc the guy said that his level 12 monk build could 1 round anything in the monster manual, but only did ~150 damage per round.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:30:40 No.43299361 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299401 >>43299426 >>43299435 >>43299463

Think of one of the evil outsider races/factions.

Now write an adventure or plot where the pc's are on their side and actively working with them, and without betraying previous alignment

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO Eridin (12th Level - 10th Monk-2 (...).pdf, 533KiB, 1x1

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:31:00 No.43299368 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43301096

>>43299211
Except I did, and here it is:

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:31:41 No.43299377 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299391

>>43299337
>Fuck people who do 3d6 where they lie, seriously.

Faggot babby too weak to deal with a shit roll and tough it out?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:31:52 No.43299378 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43299343
It's a Zen Archer right? That's what usually is described as the only decent Monk build.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:32:55 No.43299391 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299399

>>43299377
You haven't played as a Wizard with an Int score too low to cast Fox's Cunning.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:33:37 No.43299399 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43299391
>You haven't played as a wizard

Got that right.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:33:46 No.43299401 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299460

>>43299361
Easy. Qlippoth hate evil and sin because demons took away their Abyss. If no evil mortals would exist no new demons would be created. Ergo heroes on a crusade against evil would help them in the long term (not in the short term though as slaying all those evil people creates more demons at first)

Gareth !klGnb3zBKk

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO Sanity.jpg, 32KiB, 300x230

Gareth !klGnb3zBKk Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:34:39 No.43299412 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299452 >>43299493

I live once more. Available for questions/feedback/whatever. May or may not shortly be getting drunk.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:35:12 No.43299425 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299473 >>43299783

>>43299102
>Now maybe you can start making an actual character
You mean a wizard, right?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:35:12 No.43299426 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43299361
Asmodeus needs help stopping Demons from corrupting and taking over Sargava. Done.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:35:46 No.43299435 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43299361

Rakshasa

Party must help Rakshasa to infiltrate and assassinate a chaotic evil king/emperor?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:36:13 No.43299439 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299473 >>43299783

>>43299102
>I'm sorry, you can't optimize with 15? Fucking good. Now maybe you can start making an full Caster
ftfy

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:37:01 No.43299452 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299604

>>43299412
Question, Cursed Razor's level 9 maneuver's only secondary effect is to reduce affected targets' movement speeds to 0, right(and make fliers drop to the ground)? The use of the word immobilize in other situations (namely a couple spells) generally involves creatures getting paralyzed.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:37:22 No.43299460 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43299401
Qlippoth aren't usually shown to have much capacity to plan with the long-term in mind. They're really fucking impatient; they want the Abyss back and they want it back now, goddammit. Anything that advances that goal in the immediate moment gets pursued regardless of the long-term implications of that action. If you want cunning, omnicidal evil outsiders that can play the long-term game, look at the Daemons instead. Qlippoth are kinda like the goblins of the outsider world, except there are some types of Qlippoth that are definitely more than mere cannon fodder.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:37:24 No.43299463 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299508

>>43299361

Papa Nito wants some dragons dead

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:38:02 No.43299473 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299498 >>43299508

>>43299425
>>43299439
You don't have to roll a full caster to be effective at 15 PB, you dull-witted turds.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:39:03 No.43299493 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299574

>>43299412
Hi Gareth, PoW: E related question.
Scarlet Throne Style reads:
"When wielding your weapon in one hand and not two weapon fighting, your weapon is treated as being wielded with two hands for feats and abilities which would benefit from this change. While in this style you cannot make attacks with your off hand or anything held in your off hand."

Does this allow me to make a Zweihander Sentinel's abilities to work with a one-handed weapon?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:39:49 No.43299498 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43299473
Maybe not, but the effectiveness of a full caster isn't diminished as much by a drop in PB as much as the effectiveness of a non-full caster is, particularly the wizard and witch, who are both turbo-SAD.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:40:37 No.43299508 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43299463
>Nito
>evil
U wot m8

>>43299473
Except any martial will be incapable of being useful in non-combat situations without DM fiat or massive minmaxing. You'd be essentially barring entire playstyles behind a wall of mediocrity, which forces players to spend more time trying to keep up instead of not worrying and focusing more on roleplay

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:41:02 No.43299513 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299534 >>43299550 >>43299566 >>43299664

I desire to make an Ersatz of Ruby Rose as a Numerian Refugee who joined one of the less cunty Hellknight Orders in Golarion's Darkest Timeline (where all the APs save Iron Gods and Skull and Shackles have had their Bad Ends). Mostly as an NPC to serve as a Good Aligned liason for Cheliax towards the party (once they become important enough to be players in the Game) and get the guy playing the Zealot|Warrior of the Holy Light Mageknight to get his head out of his ass about Cheliax.

Which he would literally rather fight than the whole "infinite horde of cyberdemons" thing going on in Cheliax.

How would I stat her?

Currently thinking of using a straight Harbinger and the Riven Hourglass discipline, with high Dex and Intelligence. Weapon would probably be a Railgun attached to a Scythe (as the GM, I can fiat it). Would that be about right?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:42:46 No.43299534 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299613 >>43301005

>>43299513
Actually Iron Gods had its bad end too. Hellion launched itself into the atmosphere, reached godhood and his worship spreads as a mental disease.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:44:04 No.43299550 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299571 >>43299613

>>43299513
>less cunty

Godclaw

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO 1444959070874.jpg, 104KiB, 1440x1080

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:44:43 No.43299556 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299614 >>43299651 >>43299716

sup /pfg/

I enjoy making Homebrew classes when I'm bored and was curious if I should post them at some point in the future.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:45:18 No.43299564 Report Delete

Quoted By:

Tell me how I can mash up Numeria with Numenera?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:45:22 No.43299566 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43299513

Wrath of the Righteous Bad End is... a thing... Like... holy shit is it a thing.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:45:36 No.43299571 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299613

>>43299550
Torrent and Scourge work too. Scourge even has the highest amount of LG Hellknights so far.

Elric !iXwZjp.UKU

Elric !iXwZjp.UKU Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:45:44 No.43299574 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299591

>>43299493
I'm probably better equipped to handle this question, seeing as I wrote the feat.

RAW the answer is yes. I didn't actually plan for it to work out like that, but I'm inclined to let it stand for now.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:46:00 No.43299581 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43294831
>>43299270
That's because she is LG, I think that paizo just made another typo.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:47:06 No.43299591 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299619

>>43299574
Thanks for the answer.
Heh Zweihander Sentinel/Landsknecht here I come.

Gareth !klGnb3zBKk

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO Omen Rider.jpg, 64KiB, 450x360

Gareth !klGnb3zBKk Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:48:23 No.43299604 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299646

>>43299452
Correct; victims of Festival of Shadows are not paralyzed, they just can't leave their squares unless they can teleport or otherwise move without referencing their move speeds.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:48:56 No.43299613 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299639

>>43299534
Oh, Darkest Timeline is an established thing?

The reason I didn't include Iron Gods is because I'm currently playing in it. I'm going to ignore the whole Hellion thing, though I suspected something like that was going on when Skrillex and her minions started shouting shit like "IN HELLION'S NAME".

>>43299550
>>43299571
I'll look them up. I take it the mechanics, at least, were acceptable for her? Not sure if I should have her branch into Bladecaster or not, though that seems more Weiss' thing.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:49:00 No.43299614 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299914

>>43299556
What are they ?

Elric !iXwZjp.UKU

Elric !iXwZjp.UKU Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:49:15 No.43299619 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299667

>>43299591
I hope you enjoy it. If you ever see me on here, hit me up with storytime about him. I always like reading about people that use my material.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:49:34 No.43299622 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43299316
>I'd like your opinions
Everybody use same pointbuy (duh) or same set of rolls (a concept that somehow is hard to grasp for many people).

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:50:16 No.43299629 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43296666

>Quad sixes.

Slaanesh approves of their shenannigans.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:51:23 No.43299639 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299812

>>43299613
Yeah now their shouting erodes the mind of those who hear it and turns them into more worshipers who spread the worship as plague vectors.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:51:50 No.43299646 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299746

>>43299604
Hmm. In all honesty, loving the fact that Cursed Razor has both a witch and witch-hunter feel to it at the same time.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:52:07 No.43299651 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299914

>>43299556
Make them a doc of pdf

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:53:11 No.43299664 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299812

>>43299513
>Ruby
>high Intelligence
Make her a warlord.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:53:29 No.43299667 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299717

>>43299619
Won't probably happen anytime soon, my group kind of scattered all through the country recently, but it's just a question of when we play, we will play eventually.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:54:08 No.43299675 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299722 >>43299764 >>43299859 >>43299893

I want to run a more ridiculous AP for my group, but none of them want to play Reign of Winter or Iron Gods because they feel both campaigns are TOO ridiculous. What other APs are kind of ridiculous without being as ridiculous, or at least aren't easily recognized as ridiculous until after you've played it for a while? I think if they're already several sessions in, they'll be committed enough that they won't bail even if things start getting silly.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:55:52 No.43299703 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43298918
I never said it wasn't shitty. I said that it's better than an expert with an archer. Something can be shitty without it being "OMG SHITTIEST THING EVER ROFLCOPTER MEMEMEMEMEMEMEMEMEME"

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:56:42 No.43299716 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299914

>>43299556
I'd like to see them if you can put them in a Google Doc or a PDF.

Elric !iXwZjp.UKU

Elric !iXwZjp.UKU Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:56:41 No.43299717 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299980

>>43299667
No worries. I'm familiar with that pain.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:56:55 No.43299722 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299801

>>43299675

Jade Regent.

Two words: Dire Corbies.

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO inner sea alliance.jpg, 141KiB, 366x621

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:58:09 No.43299740 Report Delete

Quoted By:

Gareth !klGnb3zBKk

Gareth !klGnb3zBKk Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:58:25 No.43299746 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299980

>>43299646
Aww, thank you. I was trying. Again, feedback is always welcome; even if it doesn't make it into the current printing there's always errata, later printing, etc etc.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 15:59:44 No.43299764 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299801

>>43299675
Wrath of the Righteous.

One word: Trumpeting.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:01:12 No.43299783 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299813 >>43299848 >>43299930 >>43299948 >>43299961

>>43299425
>>43299439
I said a CHARACTER, not a BUILD.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:01:58 No.43299801 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299829

>>43299722
Jade Regent seems lame though, and from what I hear it really lacks impact on your players unless you've done RotR first, so that your players will feel like they know the NPCs of Sandpoint.

>>43299764
To be honest, if I do WotR I'm going to change up or remove the Iomedae encounter because I don't want it to cause trouble or be so stupid. That aside, WotR seems like it could be a decent choice although Mythic stuff makes me hesitate.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:02:45 No.43299812 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299909

>>43299639
Dude. Again. I'm in the middle of an Iron Gods campaign, just finished book 1. Spoilers, brah.

>>43299664
That... is a good point.

Still, I thought I read somewhere, either here or GITP, that Harbinger was the best class to represent he abilities, even if it keyed off a stat that she didn't necessarily have. Jaune, I could definitely see as a Warlord, in terms of his mechanics at least. Ruby somewhat less so.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:02:47 No.43299813 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299840

>>43299783
A character should not fail at what they are supposed to be good at.
Unless you expect 1 trick ponies?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:03:54 No.43299829 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299897

>>43299801
Dude, I wasn't serious. WotR is awful don't do it.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:04:21 No.43299840 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299871 >>43299874 >>43299924

>>43299813
>A character should not fail at what they are supposed to be good at.
The dice decide that kind of thing.

>Unless you expect 1 trick ponies?
I expect people that actually make sense within the fucking setting and are designed to be a fucking character, not "Lol imma gud at fireballs!"

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:04:43 No.43299848 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300902

>>43299783
There are systems more suited for playing incompetent mudfarmers than Pathfinder. 15pb is equivalent of NPC array of 15 14 13 12 10 8

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:05:28 No.43299859 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299897 >>43299964 >>43300062

>>43299675
I don't know why I start getting asshurt when people call Reign of Winter or Iron Gods ridiculous/silly. Like anything that tries to make a departure from generic fluffle puff wizards and dastardly demons and giants is doing it wrong.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:06:40 No.43299871 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299919

>>43299840
So, you're talking about RP, an aspect of a character that is entirely created by the player and is only expressed in mechanics in a very minor way.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:06:53 No.43299874 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43299840
>I expect people that actually make sense within the fucking setting and are designed to be a fucking character, not "Lol imma gud at fireballs!"
I know you're trolling but none of that has anything to do with a characters actual stats. It has to do with their character. You know, all those things that aren't numbers.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:07:42 No.43299893 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43299675
Giantslayer? It's an AP about slaying Giants and very little else.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:08:00 No.43299897 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299989

>>43299829
I couldn't tell because I did ask for something more ridiculous and from my understanding WotR IS ridiculous, in its own way.

>>43299859
Okay, well let me rephrase things, then. I don't mean to imply wrong when I say ridiculous, but what I should say is different. I want that departure from "generic fluffle puff wizards and dastardly demons and giants". I want something that mixes up the usual formula of high fantasy and feels like a different direction.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:08:51 No.43299909 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43299812
>Ruby somewhat less so.
She is adorable reckless teamleader who uses melee weapon and goes fast. She is literally one trait (getting Hourglass) away from Warlord.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:09:01 No.43299914 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299995

>>43299614
>>43299651
>>43299716
Right now I'm working on a Venomancer Poison-based Invocation user (Like the 3.5 Warlock) and in the starting stages for a Death Knight Initiator.

Neither are in a presentable state.

I also made a Class that was focused on having the PC become a Dragon (without the spell casting) but there are some issues with that which I'll need to revisit later.

As well I made up a PrC that used Crafting rules to improve undead. Basically allowing you to enhance Corpses before animating them with enhanced powers and abilities.

Most of these would need work to make presentable for wider usage.

I all ready store them on google docs so it would be a simple matter of linking that once they're in a state to do so.

I was asking to see if I should even bother doing so.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:09:13 No.43299919 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299937 >>43299962 >>43299965 >>43299977

>>43299871
If you're optimizing, you're not making a character, you're making a tool for winning skill checks. If you NEED more points to build with in order to min-max your ability to win skill checks and hit things harder, then you're not competent enough to actually function with in a ROLE PLAYING game.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:09:22 No.43299924 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43299840
Actual roleplay has no bearing on stats, it's all theater of the mind. What people are complaining about with such a low point-buy is that you can't expect to HAVE a character long enough to properly roleplay them without them failing at their job, at their class, and potentially getting killed. If all you want is roleplay, then don't bother with stats at all and play a different system. Pathfinder has both roleplay AND combat/conflict/statistical information, so saying "hurrdurr roleplaying is the opposite of being gud at stats" is both stupid and wrong.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:09:50 No.43299930 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43299783
Your argument is fallacious. Kindly fuck off back to your mother's teats.

Anyways, spread beats point buy, as it keeps Minmaxers from being shitty and dumping everything they don't need to 7s. Though even then, expect the 8 to go into Charisma with those types (which is proving to be hilarious in my S&S game, because most of the party can't Friendship because of it, and thus far, only one of them have wound up making any friends amongst the crew.).

16, 16, 14, 12, 10, 8.

2 things you excel at, 2 things you're good at, 1 thing you're average at, and 1 thing you're bad at.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:10:10 No.43299937 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43299919
>If you're optimizing, you're not making a character, you're making a tool for winning skill checks.
Tempest Stormwind would like a word with you.

Gareth !klGnb3zBKk

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO letmetellyou.jpg, 383KiB, 820x801

Gareth !klGnb3zBKk Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:10:33 No.43299948 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43299783
I'm sorry, what about a lower point buy makes a player automatically better at creating a backstory, acting out a personality, & participating in the narrative elements of the campaign?

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO ReyEodred.png, 353KiB, 627x784

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:11:00 No.43299957 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300117

While we're chatting APs, has anyone got a good place to find HD maps for them?

I want to use them for Roll20, but the Map folios stick those huge key numbers in the middle of all the rooms.

I'm particularly looking for a full map of Scarwall from Curse of the Crimson Throne. I've got maps for books 1-4 but this guy vanished back in 2014 and never finished the collection - http://www.cartographersguild.com/showthread.php?t=22198

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:11:04 No.43299961 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43299783
How do you justify characters whose stats can't justify why they are on the current path for them?

Also, its kinda hard to make a lot of characters if they have the mental stats of a brick, meaning you get pigeonholed into specific characters that you can justify. The only way this doesn't have an affect is if your GM does a lot of handwaving

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:11:10 No.43299962 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43299983

>>43299919
Except I can optimize my character and ALSO roleplay. I don't see what's so hard to understand about that.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:11:16 No.43299964 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300026 >>43300062

>>43299859
Considering Iron Gods is literally a joke campaign, you're just being an idiot.

It was a joke when it was proposed, it was a joke when it was being written, and it's still a joke now that it's completed, and apparently people just want to keep this joke going and never realizing that it wasn't funny to begin with.

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO 1395615657258.png, 1MiB, 1232x1080

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:11:19 No.43299965 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43299919
>If you're optimizing, you're not making a character
That's a Stormwind Fallacy and you damn-well know it. You can have good abilities and attributes AND still roleplay, they're not mutually-exclusive. Now stop acting like a cockmonger and actually play a game, instead of shitposting on an anonymous imageboard.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:12:04 No.43299977 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43299919
Oh hai Stormwind Fallacy

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:12:16 No.43299980 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300029 >>43300031

>>43299746
>>43299717
To whichever of you it may concern:
Was there ever a playtest doc of the Pharaoh put out? I'm starting a Mummy's Mask game on Halloween and it would be a relevant option to pursue.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:12:37 No.43299983 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300050

>>43299962
>Except I can optimize my character and ALSO roleplay.

Just because you insist you can, doesn't mean you're actually doing it.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:12:56 No.43299989 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300104

>>43299897
>I want something that mixes up the usual formula of high fantasy and feels like a different direction.
>Reign of Winter is too silly
I think you just don't know what you want.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:13:11 No.43299995 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300117

>>43299914
>Venomancer Invoker
I would definitely suggest having the class do both healing and poisoning, since both are very closely-related in both reality and in fiction.
>Death Knight Initiator
How different would that be compared to a Harbinger or Warder with the Unquiet Grave discipline? Just for clarification on the matter.
>Become a dragon
Now that's something I'd like to see.

Get to work on it anon, I'm excited for it!

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:14:49 No.43300026 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300079

>>43299964
You shut your whore mouth.

Iron Gods has been the most fun campaign I've ever played in. Even if I'm the only one who ever bothers to roleplay beyond the token efforts (largely because, as a simple country lawyer and fist man extraordinary, I'm best suited as the party face.)

Elric !iXwZjp.UKU

Elric !iXwZjp.UKU Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:15:10 No.43300029 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43299980
There was one for a while, but it got pulled I believe. The Pharaoh was never in a finished state enough to be able to really give it a go. It was written by Ssalarn though, so I'll at least ask him what's up with it.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:15:10 No.43300031 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300045

>>43299980
>Was there ever a playtest doc of the Pharaoh put out?
Yes. IIRC it's delayed until PoW Augmented Expanded (or whatever its name will be).

Elric !iXwZjp.UKU

Elric !iXwZjp.UKU Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:16:13 No.43300045 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300251

>>43300031
I think we're going with "Path of War: Seriously, how far away is this war already?"

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO 1403314262068.jpg, 24KiB, 189x263

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:16:24 No.43300050 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300100

>>43299983
So, your entire argument is based around your assumption that I don't roleplay and instead make characters to win rolls through a number of leaks of logic despite having no information on the subject.

All because I think 15 PB makes weaker characters mechanically than 20 or 25.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:16:38 No.43300054 Report Delete

Quoted By:

Longsword costs 5 gold less than a steel Terbutje but is identical in every other way.
Why would you ever use a Terbutje?
Is there a feat or something that Paizo uses to justify this bullshit?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:17:08 No.43300062 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43299859
Because people like >>43299964 don't seem to get that a world doesn't have to be Generic European Fantasy Land #372 to be fantasy.

Greyhawk had spaceships, Earthly technology, and all the teleportation/simulacrum/polymorphing shenanigans that Gary Gygax loved and included from the very beginning. Eberron has walking robots and evil dream-horrors alongside a 13-year-old girl as the Pope.

Golarion is poorly-written as a world, but that doesn't mean that aspects of said poorly-written world aren't good. The Land of the Linnorm Kings is great for instance, and the Order of the Hell Knights are a fantastic thing to include in a campaign as a concept and as a usable faction.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:17:37 No.43300077 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43294936
Goddamn jace ruining other games.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:17:43 No.43300079 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300214

>>43300026
>Iron Gods has been the most fun campaign I've ever played in

Why do you not realize that this doesn't actually mean anything? You can have fun pelting the people across the table in the face with dice and making Monty Python jokes, that doesn't mean the campaign is good and everyone has to enjoy it.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:19:07 No.43300100 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300147 >>43300194

>>43300050
>All because I think 15 PB makes weaker characters mechanically than 20 or 25.

I think you missed something somewhere. No one is fucking arguing that 15 points doesn't make weaker characters. Rather, a hoard of retards are insisting that 25 points is mandatory, because they can't imagine playing non-optimized or slightly weaker characters for the sake of something that makes more sense.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:19:19 No.43300104 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300136

>>43299989
I know what I want, it's just that my players don't want it. They think that Reign of Winter is too silly, the idea of traveling to Earth/killing Rasputin breaks immersion, and would prefer guns to not be in the game. I'm perfectly fine with all of the above, though.

Anyway, all I mean to ask for is if there's a middle ground between RoW/IG and the more generic, standard fantasy APs.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:20:15 No.43300117 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300137 >>43300318

>>43299957
I'm running WoTR and they have the versions without the Numbers in that mapfolio.

I've heard that the earlier ones don't have that option though so maybe that is the case.

>>43299995
The Venomancer does some basic self-healing but I haven't implemented any ability that allows it to heal others...though the idea has some merit.

The Death Knight was actually one I started before the harbinger...I will agree that I'm debating continuing it for that very reason. It was a class that started by choosing a type of Undead and gaining abilities that brought it closer to that type of undead.

The Dragon was a powerful class and to express that it had to invest 75% of all it's wealth in a hoard. I had the idea of granting bonuses for investing more but it was quickly broken in the playtesting I did. I need to revisit it mainly for the Hoard and figure out something that works.

All of them require a more in-depth explanation of some mechanics to be something I'd share publicly.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:20:24 No.43300120 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300134 >>43300156 >>43300202 >>43300311 >>43300845

Level 12 Hobgoblin Kineticist

Attributes = Str 10 (Base 8, Size 2), Dex 26 (Base 16, Racial 2, Level 2, Enhancement 4, Size 2), Con 27 (Base 16, Racial 2, Level 1, Enhancement 4, Size 4), Wisdom 11, Intelligence 13, Charisma 8

HP = 103 (8+49.5+96-50), Current Burn 5 (4 to either Enveloping Winds or Shroud of Water, 1 to Aerial Evasion), Max Burn 11

Missile weapons - 50% miss or 40% miss

AC = 31 (9 Armor, 8 Dex, 4 Shield) or 33 (9 Armor, 8 Dex, 6 Shield)

BAB 9/4

Attack = +19 (probably +20 for attacking from elevation)

Damages:
>Air Blast = 6d6+28 (average 49, Empowered 73.5), Targets AC, Bludgeoning Damage, (0,1) burn
>Cold Blast = 6d6+12 (average 33, Empowered 49.5), Targets Touch AC, Cold Damage, (0,1) burn
>Blizard Blast = 12d6+34 (Average 76, Empowered 114), Targets AC, 1/2 Piercing + 1/2 Cold Damage, (2,3) burn

0 burn combination attacks:
>Extreme Range Gusting Blizzard Blast (960 ft)
>Extended Range Entangling Blizzard Blast (240 ft)
>Extended Range Chilling Cold Blast (240 ft)
>Chilling Blizzard Blast (60ft)
>Gusting Snake Blizzard Blast (240 ft)

Elemental Overflow +4/+8, 4 Con 2 Dex 2 Str

Infusion Spec 3, Move Action Supercharge 2, Internal Buffer 2 (infusions cost 3 less, move action for next blast to cost 2 less, can store up to 2 "free" burn from different day)

Feats: Point Blank Shot, Precise Shot, Deadly Aim, Weapon Focus (Kinetic Blast), Extra Wild Talent (Entangling Enfusion), Extra Wild Talent (Snake)

Treasure 108,000 gp: Belt of +4 Dex/Con 40k, Celestial Mail 22.4k, 45.6k gp

Infusions (level,burn): ??? (1,?), Extended Range (3,1), Gusting (5,1), Expanded Element Water (7,0), Extreme Range (9,2), Chilling Blast (11,3)

Wild Talent (level,burn): Basic Aerokineticist (1,0), Air's Reach (2,0), Air Cushion (4,0), Wings of Air (6,0), Aerial Evasion (8,1), Expanded Defense (10,?), Ride the Blast (12,0)

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:21:24 No.43300134 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300184 >>43300311 >>43300382

>>43300120
He can fly around, blasting at up to 960ft away for an average of 76 damage. If people get closer, he can change to an Entangling version for the same amount of damage within 240ft. If they somehow get within 60ft, he can stagger them with a Chilling version. Or he can just target anything within 960ft and ride the blast over to it and start it up again.

>muh warrior archer

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:21:34 No.43300136 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43300104
>Anyway, all I mean to ask for is if there's a middle ground between RoW/IG and the more generic, standard fantasy APs.

...every other fucking campaign? That's a really, really vague description.

You're asking if there is a setting somewhere between over-the-top ridiculous "Fuck fantasy we're doing whatever we want" and Sandpoint. The answer is, obviously yes.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:21:37 No.43300137 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43300117
For The Dragon, you might want to look at the GitP forums for something called The Teramach, it might have exactly what you're looking for with some of its abilities.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:22:16 No.43300147 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300169

>>43300100
My biggest issue with 15 pb is that it basically means anything that's not SAD is not an option.

To me it makes Wizards and other primary casters even more powerful in comparison to the lowly martials. And of course playing a Gish is right out.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:22:42 No.43300156 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300173

>>43300120
Where is he getting a size bonus from that boosts both DEX and CON? Aren't those usually opposite of each other with size?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:22:43 No.43300157 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43299297
15pb is basically GO SAD OR GO HOME

Which generally means casters.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:23:27 No.43300169 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300207

>>43300147
>To me it makes Wizards and other primary casters even more powerful in comparison to the lowly martials

Well, then don't let casters play. It's not like it makes the game worse.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:23:36 No.43300173 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43300156
Elemental Overflow grants size bonuses to physical stats that you can choose.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:24:15 No.43300184 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300211

>>43300134
>blasting at up to 960ft
Is 960ft first range increment or last?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:24:50 No.43300194 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300227

>>43300100
>Rather, a hoard of retards are insisting that 25 points is mandatory, because they can't imagine playing non-optimized or slightly weaker characters for the sake of something that makes more sense.
Actually, it's because mechanically, certain classes can not achieve their intended/expected mechanical goals at lower pb against opponents of their level after early game without the DM intentionally lowballing what the party encounters.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:25:08 No.43300202 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43300120
Also: not a single stat below 8. Those stats aren't even autism tier

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:25:38 No.43300207 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43300169
Yes, because telling the Monk and several other classes "get fucked you will never have the stats you need to function" is a good way to play the game.

Oh wait, you're retarded, fuck off.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:26:09 No.43300211 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43300184
There is no range increment. If it's in that range you attack it.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:26:28 No.43300214 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43300079
What makes a campaign good if not the fact that it's enjoyable, runs well, and is internally consistent?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:27:23 No.43300227 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300265 >>43300281 >>43300366

>>43300194
As a DM, I would absolutely always prefer a party that's not even close to optimized, because it actually gives leeway to regulate challenge.

When a party is all 25-point Wizards and Super-Ninjas and Barbarians, it's near impossible to challenge them without cranking everything up to absurd levels, and fucking suprise, Rocket Tag doesn't make for good games.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:29:06 No.43300251 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300264

>>43300045
Path of War: Hit the Road

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:29:08 No.43300253 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300297 >>43300310

Would the union between a human and a daemon create a teifling, or can only demons and devils create them?

I ask because fiendish sorcery only gives advantages to the abysmal and infernal bloodlines, and no mention of daemons are in the description at all.

Elric !iXwZjp.UKU

Elric !iXwZjp.UKU Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:30:04 No.43300264 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300296

>>43300251
Path of War: Just pull over and ask for directions

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:30:07 No.43300265 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300366

>>43300227
>because it actually gives leeway to regulate challenge.
This is completely and utterly wrong because it's likely that the party's going to end up all over the fucking place in terms of power and when that happens you're going to have a shit time trying to challenge the party as a whole.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:30:36 No.43300274 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300361 >>43300395

what do you do when the GM cheats in your favor so that you don't die? "The oger misses you again" four times in a row is an example.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:30:50 No.43300281 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43300227
Generally speaking, in the games I've both run and played in: the higher the point-buy, the LOWER the PC tiers. Whereas at 15 everyone is playing a Wizard or a Cleric, at 20 or 25 points people are willing to try out things like the Bard, Inquisitor, Alchemist, and even the Monk or Unchained Rogue, because they can afford to start with decent numbers in multiple stats.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:31:30 No.43300296 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300331 >>43300355

>>43300264
Path of War 2: Wulin Boogaloo

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:31:31 No.43300297 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300316 >>43300336

>>43300253
There is a feat called fiendish heritage. Look it up. All sorts of evil outsiders can create Tieflings. Even Qliphoths.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:32:19 No.43300310 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43300253
In the book Blood of Fiends, it says that any Evil Outsider can taint a bloodline in order to create a tiefling later down the line. Daemons are given as an example and have access to Death Knell as an SLA instead of Darkness, as well as having Perception and Disable Device as their +2 bonuses.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:32:20 No.43300311 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300447 >>43300623

>>43300120
>>43300134
>/pfg/ bitches about the kinetistist
>gets told
>bitching intensifies
>post facts
>/pfg/ pretends it never happened

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:32:42 No.43300316 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300337 >>43300349

>>43300297
Are the other variants really that much better than a regular Tiefling that they need to be feat-gated?

Would it break anything to say 'all Tiefling variants are available as races' if I wanted to run a game where, say, Oni-spawn would be the most appropriate Tiefling?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:32:49 No.43300318 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43300117
>I'm running WoTR and they have the versions without the Numbers in that mapfolio.
>I've heard that the earlier ones don't have that option though so maybe that is the case.

Damn, yeah I'm running CotCT, which is the second one they ever did. Looks like I'll need to manually do this, and somehow get all the assets.

Cheers though.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:33:35 No.43300331 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43300296
Lost on the Path of War

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:33:47 No.43300336 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300543 >>43300578

>>43300297
>even Qippoths

>some human woman saw a Qippoth and thought
>"I wanna fuck that. I'm going to be able to tell all my friends I fucked that, and they'll never be able to one up me."

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:33:59 No.43300337 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43300316
Yes. My DM uses that ruling. There is really no need for that feat.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:34:50 No.43300349 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43300316

Fiendish Heritage is an out of date feat. When they did the Aasimar book, they made no such feat for them, so it's implied it is no longer required for Tieflings either.

The only limit to playing as a specific type of Tiefling is the DM allowing it or not.

Elric !iXwZjp.UKU

Elric !iXwZjp.UKU Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:34:56 No.43300355 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300419

>>43300296
We're actually already on 2. Path of War: Expanded is the 2nd PoW book.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:35:19 No.43300361 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300579

>>43300274

Call him a shit GM.

There is nothing wrong with fudging things to keep people alive and (more importantly) ensure everyone is having fun, but that's just lazy.
At least have the enemy try to disarm, or mock. Better yet, always have a contingency plan and have an NPC ally ready or a reason for the enemies to bolt off.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:35:47 No.43300366 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43300227
What you are saying is that you want it to be easier for you to control the game how you see fit.
The problem is that your control is coming at the expense of your players, not for their benefit.
A MAD class is going to be even less capable of holding their end than a caster with lower pb. You are trading in the ability for some of the players to realize their characters, whilst others will be hardly inconvenienced.
>>43300265 beat me to it, you are ENHANCING the work you are doing because the power scale within the party is all over the map, unless the party picks from near tiers.
I can give you an example: in my game right now, the DM went with 15 pointbuy and severely backloaded magic equipment, while keep us in an area with poor resources. Fortunately, the party was 2 paladins, a unchained monk, a warlord and a warlock.
Then the warlord died, and was replaced by a wizard, and the wizard has singlehandedly warped the game as it was up to that point because now, we can get to where ever we need to via teleport, so leaving the entire area was the first thing we did to find a place to use our money.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:36:39 No.43300382 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300432

>>43300134
>for an average of 76 damage.
76 damage is joke tier by level 12 and is what a generic Fighter archer was doing 2 levels ago with a less incremented Weapon Training, no GWS, one less iterative, and without Haste. It takes you three rounds to take out an equal-CR enemy in a game where you should be killing them in two tops and preferably one.

All you succeeded in doing was proving that the Kineticist is shit.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:37:26 No.43300395 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43300274
>"The oger misses you again" four times in a row is an example.
Anon, I rolled 7 1-3s in a row in one battle.
One day, I rolled nothing above a 9 the entire session. Maybe you have an honest gm that plays it the way it lands, and you aren't used to it?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:38:54 No.43300419 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300460

>>43300355
Yeah but people get away with that whole 'not-numbered-sequel-leads-into-numbered-sequel' thing all the time.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:39:35 No.43300432 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300445 >>43300501 >>43300539 >>43301167

>>43300382
Post your facts then. You archer also isn't entangling and staggering anything, but whatever.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:40:16 No.43300445 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43300432
Dead is more valuable than disabled

Disabled is good, but dead is the best status effect of all

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:40:25 No.43300447 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300573

>>43300311
The monk and the barbarian posted hit for more damage, are more survivable with better saves and more hp.
The only advantage I see is flight, which is negligible, and range, which actually doesn't come in to play, because the checks to see a target past 500' away (you still need to be able to SEE a target to hit it) become punishing.

Elric !iXwZjp.UKU

Elric !iXwZjp.UKU Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:40:54 No.43300460 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300525 >>43300533

>>43300419
Yes, but we try to have standards anon.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:43:27 No.43300501 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300537 >>43300573 >>43301167

>>43300432
See Farshot Fallon.

http://paizo.com/threads/rzs2kac7?The-DPR-Olympics-or-Im-not-the-mechanic-here

They're not even that optimized.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:45:23 No.43300525 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300574

>>43300460
Elric, one question. It's been stated that maneuvers completely refresh one minute after combat as the encounter ends, but what happens, specifically to a mystic if combat happens within the next minute (As in 20-30 seconds or so)-does his maneuver cycle keep going and does he keep generating animus?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:46:00 No.43300533 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43300460
I like 2Path2War, myself.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:46:14 No.43300537 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43300501

We aren't having the DPR olympics here. This is about valid, usable, universal benchmarks. We are looking at a standard well made character.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:46:20 No.43300539 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300573

>>43300432
Tangleshot arrows are relatively dirt cheap, especially at that level.

Or you could be an Eldritch Archer and useba relatively simple debuff spell or something

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:46:48 No.43300543 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43300336
Tentacles man, it's hard to deny their call.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:48:23 No.43300573 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300607 >>43300624

>>43300447
>Moderately optimized kinetistist not as powerfull as heavily optimized barbarian and zen archer
no shit sherlock. But the ORIGINAL goal posts were "not a shit class", and "better than warrior archer".

If optimized zen archer and barbarian are the new standards for "not a shit build", then damn son, but I can't compete in this game anymore.

>>43300501
>farshot falon
no clustered shot, therefore theory-build that isn't useful for actual play.

>>43300539
we are all aware that elderich archer is the go-to in ranged burst "fuck you". Fun class to play though.

>>43300539
>Tangleshot arrows
and come with a DC 10

Elric !iXwZjp.UKU

Elric !iXwZjp.UKU Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:48:29 No.43300574 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43300525
If the encounter hasn't ended yet, they continue their current maneuver cycling. If it's even 1 second past the minute after combat ends, they start over from the beginning. Of course, whether or not that happens is up to your GM and the specific context of the game you're in.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:48:51 No.43300578 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43300336
>Innsmouth in a nutshell

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:48:51 No.43300579 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300598

>>43300361
>There is nothing wrong with fudging things to keep people alive

I disagree, but mainly because if your players died it's because of one of two things: Shit luck, which is part of the game, or they got stupid and picked a fight with something they shouldn't have.

This is assuming the game's combat encounters are primarily built around level-appropriate enemies.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:49:30 No.43300590 Report Delete

Quoted By:

guys what does level 2 solar-wind-maneuver Solar flare do.
d20pfsrd has literally

>Discipline: Solar Wind (Strike); Level: 2
>Initiation Action: 1 standard action
>Range: Ranged attack
>Target: One creature
>Duration: Instant

>DESCRIPTION

>Where the light of the sun touches, so does the burning reach of the Solar Wind disciple, allowing

and stops

the other line says
>Make a ranged attack and add +2d6 fire damage and ignore cover.

is it just a strike that ignores all concealment and then does a bonus 2d6 damage?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:49:32 No.43300593 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300637

>no half protean race
>no half inevitable race
>no half aeon race
>no half elemental race FILTHY GENIES DON'T COUNT
get on the ball paizo

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:50:06 No.43300598 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300633

>>43300579
Yeah, but there are lots of little things that might be worth more than they appear

DR against low-level characters, for example. DR10/Magic can shit all over a low level party before they get their first +1.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:51:07 No.43300607 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43300573
Clustered Shots wasn't available at the time(and neither were Gloves of Dueling, which is a solid +2 to hit and damage) . It's not hard to fit it in.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:51:16 No.43300612 Report Delete

Quoted By:

Can we jump back to the Eldritch Archer gun using build? I'd really like to see this fleshed out, because unfortunately it seems quite difficult to pull off in terms of leveling.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:52:21 No.43300623 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300688

>>43300311
WILL /PFG/ ADMIT THEY WERE WRONG ABOUT SOMETHING? WILL /PFG/ REALIZE THAT A KINETISTIST IS IN THE SAME LEAGURE OF A ZEN ARCHER, OPTIMIZED FIGHTER ARCHER, OR POUNCING BARBARIAN? TUNE IN TO FIND OUT.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:52:31 No.43300624 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300640

>>43300573
>heavily optimized barb
Because one of the decent rages, bog standard magic equipment, and traits to support the rage are heavy optimizing?
Also, that kineticist is the higher range of optimizing, not moderate.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:53:25 No.43300633 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43300598
True, but then again, the PCs are expected to either git gud and figure out a way to handle it (and if your GM's any good, you will have the means to do so, either on-hand as part of your gear or abilities or it's readily available upon engaging the enemy), or the GM is expressly being an asshole about it and there's nothing you can do but pack up and leave for another game.

Assuming ideal conditions, the party will never need to experience a PC fatality by dint of the game mechanics working the way they should outside of an occasional statistical anomaly or major boss fight. And when it happens, it happens.

I've had a let-the-dice-fall-where-they-may GM before. Shit's fun as hell because you're not invincible and you know it.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:53:43 No.43300637 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300652 >>43301221

>>43300593
I think Ganzi are kinda like half proteans.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:53:55 No.43300640 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300650 >>43300684

>>43300624
AND IT TURNS OUT NOOOOOoooooo...

THEY HAVE RESORTED TO SPLITTING HAIRS AND SEMANTIC ARGUMENTS! DID ANYONE EVER NOT EXPECT THIS EVEN A LITTLE BIT?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:54:19 No.43300644 Report Delete

Quoted By:

Are juju fetishes at all worth picking up the revelation for? I heard they were temporary but I assume that also means they're cheap.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:54:58 No.43300650 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300687

>>43300640

Provide some proof not hyperbolic bullshit

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:55:08 No.43300652 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300690

>>43300637
Yes, but are also unfortunately disappointing. Thanks, Crysbama.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:55:10 No.43300653 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300670 >>43300681

Have I gone absolutely batshit crazy?

Was Spell Focus not a +1 CL to chosen schools?

I justed checked and its now saying a +1 DC on related saves.

What the fuck /tg/?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:56:06 No.43300670 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43300653
Spell Focus was always +1 to spell DC for that school.

Except when it was 3.0 because then it was +2 to spell DC. What the fuck were they thinking?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:56:39 No.43300681 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43300653
It's always been that.
Mage's tattoo will do the +1CL

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:56:43 No.43300683 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43295790
His powers are waning. Chaotic Good is getting repetitive. Hell's Vengeance is going to stir the pot, and things will become different.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:56:51 No.43300684 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43300640
So why don't you take this to the forums that pick classes apart, rather than here?
No one seems to really care save you, and somehow, you think you have discovered something the rest of the internet hasn't, and continue to act like /tg/ is the only place that says the kineticist is an awful class.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:56:56 No.43300687 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300719 >>43300781

>>43300650
AND IT TURNS OUT THEY DIDN'T EVEN READ THE THREAD! WHAT A COMPLETELY UNSURPRISING PERFORMANCE FROM THE M'SIRS AT /PFG/!

TUNE IN NEXT TIME, WHERE WE WILL COVER:

/PFG/ AND THE BATTLE TO BRING -4STR BACK!

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:57:00 No.43300688 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300781

>>43300623
Heavily optimized kineticist is in the same league as a moderately optimized barbarian, fighter, or the like for damage. It's got more utility than either.

Kineticist is a very low tier 4. It can function (it's much more functional than the Medium if the Medium isn't only using Archmage and Hierophant), but its class features hamstring it and it has very few things it's /good/ at.

That's pretty much the definition of tier 4. Kineticist is shit because of its design, but can be made to function. Literally every class can be made to function okay technically Commoner needs some 3.5 material to function WELL, but that's besides the point.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:57:09 No.43300690 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300708

>>43300652
>Expecting anything but shit from Crystal "The Empyreal Lord backed Matriarchy totally is okay with Asmodeus" Frasier

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:58:32 No.43300708 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300749

>>43300690
I still want to hear what their attempted explanation for this is.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 16:59:33 No.43300719 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300781

>>43300687

I CAN TALK IN ALL CAPS THAT MEANS I'M RIGHT AND EVERYONE ELSE IS WRONG

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 17:00:41 No.43300740 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300754 >>43300781

>all these people bitching about the kineticist
>dont even talk about the shitshow that the medium became

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 17:01:24 No.43300749 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300786

>>43300708
Asmodeus somehow saved the day in the city of Anuli in the past so they worship him as LN god.
Also the trait that allows that is regional trait for her stupid pet nation. Which means you can make a Paladin of Asmodeus only if he is from her retarded pet nation and you can't do it as as a chelish paladin.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 17:01:43 No.43300754 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43300740

We're trying to block it out. Alcohol may be involved.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 17:03:35 No.43300781 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300844 >>43301270

>>43300688
I'm the guy who made those barb and monk builds, and apart from making the point buy super-autistic, I don't see much I can do to further optimize them. I've spent a lot of time optimizing them too.

>>43300688
I don't buy it. I haven't ever seen a bard that does relevant damage in combat, much less a warrior or a commoner. There are plenty of classes that claim tier 3 yet I have never seen a "does not suck shit in actual fight under level 12" build. Willing to change my mind if you post one though.

>>43300687
>-4str
ok that was funny

>>43300719
The guy proved that a kinetistisst can do ~80% of the damage of an optimized zen archer,and ~70% of the damage of an optimized barbarian, all without spending any resources. My mind is officially changed. Why isn't yours?

>>43300740
honestly the medium is a perfect example of a "tier 4+ class" that can't do shit and is completely worthless.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 17:03:56 No.43300786 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300808 >>43301043

>>43300749
>Paladin of Asmodeus

When Paizo heard about this trait they swooped in to specify this is not intended.

"To summarize Wes:

*The trait was not intended to allow paladins of Asmodeus.

*We have no plans to publish actual paladins of Asmodeus (though it might be fun to have some Asmodean scammers calling themselves paladins, just to mess with people...).

*PFS will not be allowing paladins of Asmodeus.

*You can do whatever you want in your home game. This was true before we published the feat, and remains true today. :)

That's not just Wes talking—last I checked in with all the various stakeholders, that was Paizo's official stance. So if you're a person who cares about official stances, that's ours. :D"

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 17:05:29 No.43300808 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300830 >>43300841

>>43300786
I wonder if Crystal was trying to allow for Paladins of Asmodeus and then got shut down on the attempt by someone higher on the ladder.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 17:06:13 No.43300818 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300845

>>43298482
Please, post your actual, functional kineticist, and how it manages to make it through as much of a day of battles as any other class. Or just go back to crying about your ban on your fucking tumblr you baby.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 17:06:56 No.43300830 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300879

>>43300808
That would run counter to Paizo's usual soapbox position. Anyone following Asmodeus couldn't possibly be good.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 17:07:15 No.43300841 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43300879 >>43301096

>>43300808

Why does Crystal Fraiser want a paladin of the Patriarchy anyway? Is this some truth-in-PUA thing where feminists are secretly wet at the thought of getting dominated by strong men or something? I don't get it one bit

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 17:07:30 No.43300844 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43301096

>>43300781
I can't create a build very quickly, but the Bard's main strength is being a force-multiplier for the rest of the party and for being able to do plenty of crap outside of the fight. By himself, a Bard is a lot less effective compared to in a full party.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 17:07:36 No.43300845 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43300818
did you literally not read the thread?

I guess I'm not above providing help to the stupid:
>>43300120

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 17:10:10 No.43300878 Report Delete

Quoted By:

Why does every Bardic archetype insist on fucking with Versatile Performance?

I'm really sad that I can't play a Juggler Rubato with Solar Wind.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 17:10:11 No.43300879 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43301015

>>43300841
Why does her Divine Matriarchy support Asmodeus anyways? Doesn't make sense anyways.

>>43300830
Well that trait technically allows that.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 17:11:34 No.43300902 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43299848
>15pb is equivalent of NPC array of 15 14 13 12 10 8
That's heroic array. The NPC array is 13 12 11 10 8 6

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO vb_55_colonel_hunter_gathers.jpg, 338KiB, 1280x720

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 17:17:48 No.43300997 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43301096 >>43301281

Here's a question: How would one classify a Kineticist as "Standard" considering many of its options are inherently inferior than others? Afterall, its a given that Air is infinitely more useful than others elemental focuses, but how much would that weigh in terms of optimization?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 17:18:40 No.43301005 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43301027

>>43299534
>Hellion

You mean Unity?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 17:19:13 No.43301015 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43301040 >>43301096 >>43301102

>>43300879
Technically, yes, but am I the only one who remembers the Erastil retcon debacle? It wasn't that long ago. There was a statement from a certain Paizo employee who made their statement very clear that anything other than total female empowerment is bad by default, therefore Erastil shouldn't have the character traits he had, despite them not being inherently wrong.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 17:19:57 No.43301027 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43301632

>>43301005
Ah sheit you are right. How did I mix those up?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 17:20:45 No.43301040 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43301135

>>43301015
To clarify - They retconned these traits out of Erastil, because nobody good could have them.

So why is a Paizo writer trying to make Asmodeus out to NOT be The Bad Guy he actually is?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 17:21:12 No.43301043 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43301082 >>43301096 >>43301116

>>43300786
Why aren't there paladins of various non good deities? I mean, a paladin is more or less a holy warrior of a god, like a cleric is a holy caster. How come there's clerics of all shapes and sizes but paladins are LG only?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 17:24:12 No.43301082 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43301043

A LG Paladin can still be a Paladin of Abadar etc. As long as the alignments are within a step, the Paladin can serve that deity. Keep in mind also, Paladins don't gain their power from a deity, they gain it from their own burning will of lawful goodness.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 17:25:04 No.43301096 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43301181

>>43300841
Lets not judge people by their fetishes. Seriously...look where you are posting.

>>43300844
I can see that, but things like +4 to attack&damage aren't really impressive when you have one of >>43299368 or >>43299167 in the party. They aren't a bad utility caster I agree, but I feel like you need to to provide more. Most of the time one of these builds will be combined with 3 other unoptimized builds and will need to pull most of the weight on its own, and I just can't see a bard doing that.

>>43300997
The earth one gets earthglide, tremorsense(sorta..its weird), and some nifty move earth abilities. You could start your own construction company...or just demolish buildings.

>>43301015
You mean the debacle where we bitched on the forums about the "strong women should stay home and pregnant" version of Erastil? yea I thought we agreed that we were being dumb on that one. Most of us though we were defending current Erastil, not the old "make me sandwitch" Erastill. They thought we wanted the old version back.

>>43301043
legacy sacred cow. Anti-paladin exists, but in general alignment bound classes don't make sense.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 17:25:34 No.43301102 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43301181

>>43301015

I seem to remember we got a little confused there.

Some people jumped in defending Erastil as he exists now, while others were in support of Erastil when he took a more dim view of females adventuring, and confusion developed over whether we were arguing that Erastil's way of thinking as he exists now is sexist or not (it isn't) while other people took away that it was an argument about whether you could be both sexist and Lawful Good.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 17:26:25 No.43301116 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43301128

>>43301043
Because Paladins don't get their powers from God's, rather they get it from the pure Divine Concept of LG/Justice. It's just that worshipping a God is an easy way to build faith and act as a useful guide. Also sponsorship helps with resources and respect

Although I agree we need Paladin alternates for CG and LE also, of course mechanically different from their LG and CE cousins

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 17:27:31 No.43301128 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43301162

>>43301116

Paladins of Freedom existed back in 3.5, didn't they? Tyranny, too, I recall.

Seems like they'd be pretty easy archetypes.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 17:27:59 No.43301135 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43301040
Probably because Crystal "Being Trans gives you magic powers" Frasier craves his Ruby Rod.

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO Vp-lezard_mystina.jpg, 146KiB, 780x800

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 17:28:38 No.43301143 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43301159 >>43301555

Could you make an Occultist blaster work?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 17:30:00 No.43301159 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43301555

>>43301143
Sure. Take gloves as implement and become Roy Mustang.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 17:30:21 No.43301162 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43301651

>>43301128
I just let anyone play a paladin, and flavor it like a martial cleric. You get your powers from your god, you do what your god says, heal or hurt based on what your god want's, etc.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 17:30:48 No.43301167 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43301227

>>43300432
So let's bump >>43300501 up a couple levels. That gives them an iterative, Greater Weapon Specialization(Longbow), Clustered Shots, money to pick up Gloves of Dueling and Boots of Speed with money to spare, and an extra -1/+2 on Deadly Aim because they hit 12 BAB. The ability point from level 12 doesn't even matter because it's an odd stat point.

What this means in practice is that it's +3 net to hit, +6 to damage, and has a largely irrelevant iterative over the posted build. With Haste it's an extra attack and another +1 to hit, so...

no Haste:
+22(x2)/+22/+17/+12, 1d8+21 (19-20/x3) vs CR 12's AC 27

.75*51+.1*2*.75*25.5 = 42.075
.75*25.5+.1*2*.75*25.5 = 22.95
.5*25.5+.1*2*.5*25.5 = 15.3
.25*25.5+.1*2*.25*25.5 = 7.65
87.975

with Haste:
+23(x2)/+23/+23/+18/+12
.8*51+.1*2*.8*25.5 = 44.88
.8*25.5+.1*2*.8*25.5 = 24.48*2 = 48.96
.55*25.5+.1*2*.55*25.5 = 16.83
.3*25.5+.1*2*.3*25.5 = 9.18
119.85

The problem with your Kineticist is that it has to go through AC. Even assuming he's got +1 to hit from elevation that's a 65% chance to hit against CR 12, which, well...

.65*76+.05*.65*76 = 51.87 for non-empowered Blizzard Blast

.65*114+.05*.65*114 = 77.805 for empowered.

You're looking at average damage and NOT what they are actually doing in DPR to monsters of their CR.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 17:31:25 No.43301181 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43301227 >>43301611

>>43301096
>>43301102
>I seem to remember we got a little confused there.

This part I actually didn't hear about. Enlighten an anon, would you kindly? Sauce/screencaps if at all viable would be strongly appreciated. I want to edumucate myself further before continuing, because I'm liable to open my mouth and jam my foot in it if I don't.

Anonymous

View Same Google ImgOps iqdb SauceNAO PZO9285-Janzi.jpg, 107KiB, 527x1000

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 17:34:34 No.43301221 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43301248

>>43300637
I saw the picture for it on their blog before the book released and didn't even realize it was a different race, I thought it was just a spellcaster named Ganzi. Seriously, does this look like a new and different race at all, much less one related heavily to Proteans? She's not even a snake lady!

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 17:34:53 No.43301227 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43301310

>>43301181
aw man it was awhile ago. I'm also shit at dealing with the archives. Can someone else do it?

Also: Respect for educating yourself before deciding.\

>>43301167
That's a decent archer. We could also just compare the kinetistist to the zen archer posted above.

I mean...it looks liked the fighter archer and the zen archer both out-damage the kinetistist. By a bit. They are still probably "better", but at least the class is in the same league. They are certainly above warrior archer to be sure, which i think is what the whole point was.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 17:35:55 No.43301248 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43301221
>elves are just skinny humans with pointed ears and O C doughnut steel powers!
we know.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 17:37:24 No.43301270 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43301362

>>43300781
>all without spending any resources

He needs to expend burn just to have the stats he posted above. The size bonus doesn't just come from being a kineticist.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 17:37:50 No.43301280 Report Delete

Quoted By:

Has Ssalarn been around? Is he doing better? Also, how is Aurora Soul? Been thinking about rolling one recently.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 17:37:50 No.43301281 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43301362

>>43300997
It would probably move a Kineticist in Tier 4, maybe dipping down to Tier 5 for some options. The wood one, for example, is Tier 5 because all of its actually useful powers cease to function if you don't have thick foliage.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 17:39:57 No.43301310 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43301227
>They are still probably "better", but at least the class is in the same league.
Doing enough damage to kill CR 12 in 3 turns while spamming empower at the expense of burn or 4 if you avoid it is in no way in the same league as killing a CR 12 in 2 turns without expending any resources but nonmagical arrows.

It's pretty much just Warlock 2.0 and I've always thought the Warlock was incredibly shitty unless you were using their melee builds.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 17:43:54 No.43301362 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43301437 >>43301475 >>43301479 >>43301496

>>43301270
yes, and he spends that burn at the beginning of the day and it lasts all day. He even factored the burn into his "max" hp.

He also never takes burn at all when fighting. Move action to ignore 2, and he ignores 3 from any infusions. None of the listed attacks cost him any burn.

The archer is also probably expending boots of haste rounds, but yea, those really don't count.

>>43301281
I think that Kineticist is a solid tier 4. Paladin and bloodrager levels of damage + minor utility. If "you can fuck up this class by picking dumb shit" shouldn't drop a class, as you could really fuck up any class really well.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 17:49:23 No.43301437 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43301486

>>43301362

I dunno, Paladins have ABSURD fucking damage if you're playing an archer paladin who has any idea what he's doing against evil targets.

When balors cry out in their dreams, it is the archerdin they see.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 17:51:56 No.43301475 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43301362
The problem is that a Kineticist can be fucked really hard by picking the "wrong" element, and you can't unfuck that, especially with how higher level talents become unselectable because of that stupid level adjustment for secondary elements.

And then if you want more talents than the few the class provides, you have to deal with the shitty Extra Wild Talent feat.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 17:52:00 No.43301479 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43301531

>>43301362
Kineticist has no fucking power behind it. If you think it's versatile, that makes it Tier 5. If you think it isn't very versatile, that makes it Tier 6.

A paladin does more damage with far less effort, and that's not even counting smite-time.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 17:52:15 No.43301486 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43301437
>ABSURD fucking damage
against specific targets a few times a day. Plus: dead is dead, often the full power of a smiting archer paladin is wasted on what it kills.

I think the bloodrager is the best comparison. The bloodrager can deal more damage, but has trouble getting pounce so tends to have issues delivering that damage. The bloodrager also has a few spells, but not the best spell list. If you built a archer bloodrager I think it would be very similar to the kinetistist.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 17:52:50 No.43301496 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43301531 >>43301533

>>43301362
Kineticist still strikes me as a 5. Never forget that heavy optimization (like this) can bump a class up a tier - the default for Kineticist is around tier 5, but with work, they can scrape the (bottom of) tier 4 builds.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 17:55:25 No.43301531 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43301546

>>43301479
>no fucking power behind
>73.5 possible stagger damage @ 240 feet
okbud.jpg

>>43301496
>ever forget that heavy optimization (like this) can bump a class up a tier
That's not how this works.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 17:55:31 No.43301533 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43301700 >>43301728

>>43301496
No, only new builds such as archetypes can change your tier. Tier is max potential, not "what you're currently rolling".

Tier 5 means it'll never achieve the power of a Tier 4 that's slightly less optimized (and obviously can't catch up to a better optimized one) but *may* have roughly as much utility, since there's just a 1 tier difference.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 17:56:34 No.43301546 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43301638

>>43301531
dude, 73.5 is fucking pathetic.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 17:57:16 No.43301555 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43301579

>>43301143
>>43301159
Eh, looking at it seems like I'd just end up being a shittier kineticist. Why is so hard to be a good blaster without resorting to having dragon fucking in your character background?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 17:59:24 No.43301579 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43301555
Because Dragons are sexy?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 18:00:55 No.43301604 Report Delete

Quoted By:

Does anyone use any programs etc to build their characters easily like YAPCG?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 18:01:08 No.43301611 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43301181
Basically, /tg/ went on a crusade that no one at the end really knew what it was all about over Erastil.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 18:02:53 No.43301632 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43301027
Both are assholes.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 18:03:25 No.43301638 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43301709

>>43301546
For full attack melee damage maybe, but no one cares about that because you can never actually deliver that. The classes that can actually deliver their damage (gunslingers, archers, evocation casters) tend to do ~100 damage per round after misses and DR. They also tend to not be very well on the defense or the utility. Barbarian is an outliar with pounce, archer pally is an outlier with smite against evil, zen archer is an outlier due to mobility and defenses.

The kinetistist is interesting because it A: can target touch if it needs to, B: spends no resources to do this damage at almost 1000 feet, and C: has decent defenses combined with perma-fly and a 960 foot teleport if it needs it. If this is tier 5 and not tier 4, well then tier 5 is a decent tier to be in.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 18:04:25 No.43301651 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43301665

>>43301162
Why not be a martial cleric, then?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 18:05:56 No.43301665 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43301651
Because I want a goddamn magic horse.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 18:10:13 No.43301700 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43301714

>>43301533
Wrong. You should actually read the tier list posts sometime, because it's clearly stated that heavy optimization can push a class up a tier.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 18:11:04 No.43301709 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43301735

>>43301638
Are we talking level 5 here, or level 12?
Because if you're talking 20th your numbers would be about 1/3 of where they ought to be.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 18:11:31 No.43301714 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43301793

>>43301700
If by "heavy optimization" you mean "pick paragon surge" then yea, maybe.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 18:12:14 No.43301728 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43301756

>>43301533

Not at all. Tier is a rough estimate of power, all else equal.

If you put n effort into a wizard, it will be stronger than if you put n effort into a sorcerer, which is stronger than n effort in a bard, etc.

It's not a measure of max potential. If it was, it wouldn't function as it did in 3.5, since any class, even a commoner, had a max potential of High-TO shenanigans.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 18:12:31 No.43301735 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43301709
level 12, the "end game" of pathfinder because level 13 is simulacrums all the way down.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 18:12:54 No.43301739 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>tfw the Ulfen Bodyguard/Furious Guardian has so many nice things I want to grab through multiclassing like rage and willsaves, but the bodyguard stuff doesn't make sense for my character

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 18:13:39 No.43301756 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43301728
>Not at all. Tier is a rough estimate of power, all else equal.
NO. VERSATILITY. GOD DAMMIT

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 18:14:32 No.43301773 Report Delete

Quoted By:

New thread:
>>43301759
>>43301759
>>43301759
>>43301759
>>43301759

I fucking love me some pancakes captcha

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 18:15:44 No.43301793 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43301714
It's a lot easier to get from t5 to t4 than it is from t2 to t1, because t1 NEEDS prepared casting/unerrataed paragon surge/similar source of versatility while t4 just means you're moderately more competent than a t5.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 18:16:59 No.43301818 Report Delete

Quoted By: >>43301868 >>43301901

What's a Good Fighter archetype to stack with Myrmidon?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 18:19:29 No.43301868 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43301818
Lore Warden, Martial Master or Drill Sergeant, depending on what you wanna focus on.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 18:20:54 No.43301901 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43301818
Trench fighter ain't bad.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 26 Oct 2015 20:23:13 No.43303907 Report Delete

Quoted By:

>>43294831
>Remember that you can have LE clerics of Iomedae and Paladins of Asmodeus.
Pretty sure they've retconned this.

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